"Rub that thing till something happens" hahahah and just how long would you reccomend then? 10 mins 20? an hr? as none of that makes the slighest bit of difference for me, last night he went down on me and was there for about 45 mins, before i gave up and dragged the poor man up for air! so then we carried on and i got on top of him, (something i purely do for his benefit) and then stil nothing after another 20 mins of that, and then i let him do it his way and it was over then for him in a few mins, so i still stand by the fact that i dont think it is a natural thing for us women, its just plain to much hard work for not a lot of benefit from it.