Abortion? (read post before voting)

**amaranthine** · 07-20-2009 06:55 AM

PLEASE READ BEFORE VOTING!

I'm just curious. This is not here so we can attack each other for our views on this controversial topic, but just to take a collective opinion on how the people on this site feel about it.

First, I thought I'd highlight the terms.

Pro-Choice: Means that regardless of whether or not you yourself would ever get an abortion, you would never stop anyone else from doing so. You believe it should be every woman's decision, and is within her own rights to her body to make that choice.

Pro-Life: Means that, regardless of reasons or motivations for believing so, you are so against abortion that you want a law making it illegal. You don't think it should be anyone's decision to terminate a pregnancy - once you're pregnant, you're in it.

NOTE: If you think abortions should only be allowed in certain situations, but not in others, that is PRO-LIFE. Pro-choice wants everyone to be able to choose, not just a select unfortunate few.
Also, if you find that you are unsure of your opinion, just try to imagine a friend came to you asking for advice. Would you consider suggesting abortion to her? Would you be upset if she chose abortion? This may help you realize where you stand.

Feel free to post after you vote to explain your reasons, elaborate, etc.

**Little** · 07-20-2009 09:06 AM

I voted Pro-Choice, though I feel that both the names Pro-Choice and Pro-Life are highly misleading and charged with "feelings." If you're not Pro-Life, are you Pro-Death? If you're not Pro-Choice, are you Pro-Restriction? In simple terms, yes. But that's a story for another day.
In more clear terms, I'm pro-abortion. I don't think a woman needs any special reason or circumstances to get the legal right to have an abortion. There are too many unwanted children out there.
Of course, being brought up with American abortion laws, I feel that there should be a certain time line, like having the abortion within the first trimester. But the question of when a fetus becomes a "baby" or a protectable entity is difficult. Also, I think it's unsavory if a woman has too many abortions. It shouldn't be taken lightly.
America really has one of the most allowing set of abortion laws. I wish it would put a kind of waiting period or counseling to help women to deal with what they're doing, since it has been proven to be an upsetting procedure (and why shouldn't it?) I think that's the way Britain does it.

**WildChild** · 07-20-2009 09:09 AM

Well you may be opening a can of worms here, I don't know. I think it's no one's business but the woman's, with her doctor's consultation. I find the idea that the life of a fetus who is severely damaged is more valuable than that of a grown, productive woman, insane. I'm thinking of a case I saw in the news recently, with an anencephalic fetus, that could kill the mother - it was a crime for her to get an abortion where she lived or to travel to get one - that was essentially a death sentence if she obeyed the law. What kind of people, what kind of society would allow such a situation? Yet, I live in it. Surrounded by people who want that to be the law of the land.

Conception control will always be preferable to "birth" control. I'm big on accurate word usage, the term birth control implies that conception has occured. We need to straighten out our terminology, inducing labor is controlling the birth. Preventing conception is another thing altogether. Unfortuately those who are "pro-life" (I live close to a major organization promoting this) are also anti anything but abstinance for pregnancy prevention. Ironically they also oppose funding to care for the babies and their mothers.

**KaleenaC** · 07-20-2009 12:59 PM

I voted proLife b/c Its kinda like telling a newborn a new born "Hey, Im sorry but I'm not gonna have you experience life just to put a bordan on my life. It would be good to put ur baby up for adoption rather than not giving it a chance.

**amaranthine** · 07-20-2009 01:06 PM

I believe the current restriction on abortion in America is that it cannot be done after 24 weeks. It's already been proven that a fetus is incapable of feeling pain until 28 weeks, and that similar nerve functions which allow the fetus to "be aware" of itself are not developed to a usable degree until this time either (though it's also known that infants are not really aware of themselves as an individual until around 3 months).
As the law stands, a fetus will not be considered a "person" until it is born. The US Code is very specific - it uses the term "born alive", I believe. Oddly enough, this makes a baby delivered a month early a person, and an eight month old fetus not a person.
However, I think this is plenty fair. It's ridiculous to consider something a person while it still occupies the body of someone else.

All that being said, I'm pro-choice.

**Tina Lee** · 07-20-2009 01:40 PM

Geez, that's a really deep question.

I think I would be pro-choice. I think it is every woman's decision. If a friend came to me saying she was pregnant. I don't think I could suggest for her to have an abortion, but I wouldn't end my friendship with her if she did have one.

**CHANDLERS WISH** · 07-20-2009 05:30 PM

I voted pro-choice as well, although I can't imagine a baby at 24 weeks, (almost 6 months), doesn't have thought patterns, pain, etc...I would be deeply emotional if a girlfriend chose to have an abortion at 24 weeks, personally...

I think I would be trying to "discuss" it further with her, after all why carry a baby for that long if you don't want to have it?

CW

**rcoreyus** · 07-20-2009 11:44 PM

If it is a child, abortion is murder. If it is a part of the womans body, preventing abortion is depriving her of her rights.

There is no test to say what is human and what is not, and without such a test the sides can never agree.

**WildChild** · 07-21-2009 06:54 AM

Whether it can or cannot survive outside the woman's body is a pretty good "test". There are those who think masterbating is wrong because it spilling seed that could start a baby. Of course a woman's body sheds an egg every cycle and that has the same potential. Coupled with the contorversy over sex ed and contraception, it becomes clear the issue isn't so much whether it's human, as it is legislating beliefs and controlling sexuality and sexual behavior.

**amaranthine** · 07-21-2009 11:04 AM

I think it's legal to 24 weeks because it is still missing very necessary pieces of development which it could not possibly develop once removed from the womb. After that point, I think most doctors say it's possible the fetus can survive, though it would not develop as fully, and would probably have medical issues later in life.
I also think they stretch it that far because sometimes, a woman doesn't even know she's pregnant until she's quite far along. My tenth grade biology teacher didn't know she was pregnant until she was seventh months in. She had a condition where she rarely got her period, and doctors had told her she'd probably never be able to conceive. (She's also a big woman... so that's why she didn't notice her stomach growing). She was passed the point of abortion by then, but for woman who don't know until the fourth or fifth month, it's still an option for them.
Another scenario... what if a woman was raped, conceived, and was afraid to seek the abortion for a while?
Most abortions occur within the six three to six weeks. The number which occur so late along is tiny, something like 0.04%.

There's really no doubt that the fetus (or zygote, embryo, whichever stage) is human... seeing as it contains human DNA. The controversy is about whether or not it should be a "person". According to the US Constitution, under Amendment 14, only persons have rights. As previously said, the US Code defines persons as being "born alive", which wraps it up quite clearly.

There's a video on the Advocates for Pregnant Women website which shows how dangerous it would be if the unborn were granted personhood rights. What intrigued me most about the video was that it was made by pro-life women.
(I believe their goal is to outlaw abortion, yet stop fetal personhood rights from going into effect. I'm not quite sure how they settle that contradiction...)

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