Thread: Giving vs. Receiving

Bingo. It's taken me a long time to learn to be "woman" enough to stand up for what I want - and I'm still learning.

Having a voice doesn't make you a battle-axe of a woman (no matter what the double-standard may suggest). It simply means you respect yourself enough not to be taken advantage of. As women, we seem so worried about what other people think, and we seem more inclined to want people to like us. I think sometimes we forget that we're not being "mean" by saying what we want or sticking up for ourselves.

That's my big problem with Disney's "The Little Mermaid." A woman literally gives up her voice for a man. Great thing to teach our children. Too bad the songs are so darn catchy.

Originally Posted by ManINeedACoffee

Allie, you pretty much hit the nail on the head there. I'm a giver myself, but the last guy I was involved with, while he did reciprocate, it wasn't nearly as often, though he was - as men can be - pretty obsessed with getting bjs. But it always felt like he was reciprocating because he didn't want to be a prat, and if I didn't "finish" in an acceptable amount of time, it always seemed like he'd find an excuse to stop. He knew I was disappointed, but didn't seem to care very much. But...that pretty much went for most aspects of our relationship. Though now there's a part of me that feels slightly amused at the fact that this particular man is about to marry a girl whom he complains doesn't give bjs very much...

That is horribly wrong of me, I know, but...I think it's a human way to react to someone who always took you for granted.

Now I'm in a healthy relationship with another "giver" - very affectionate, appreciative, attentive, generous, and "thorough." The greatest thing about this is that it all makes me even MORE inclined to be the same way toward him. Nothing quite like being intimate with someone who loves you every bit as much as you love them, and isn't afraid to show it. I'm new to this whole "equal amounts of generosity" thing, but I sure am liking it.

I am so happy you found someone who cherishes you as a giver. Sometimes difficult for a female giver to find. I an a giver too and an early bad experience with a man made me very cautious about what I am willing to give. Giving does not come so easily for me now in a relationship that is, until I am sure that the man is worth the trouble. So the user men don't make it to first base.

I don't blame women who get into this bj trap, most girls start out wanting to please boys and get burned along the way and become more discriminating. By that time, some men have become addicted and easy to manipulate with the hope of a bj and on a life long search for some mouth to do it. Bj's seem to be the crack cocaine of sex for many men and they show no self control just demands or begging - not attractive. I think bj addicts forget there is a living breathing woman connected to that mouth and she is not required to satisfy his addiction just because he has it.

Like your old boyfriend - karma - he probably thought he hit the jackpot with a generous woman like you but he actually failed to learn self-control and the necessity of mutual satisfaction of a partner to maintain the sexual connection. He ain't going to get no bj after that wedding but that is his payback. Not good to celebrate misfortune but it's a common lament of men and they can trace it back to selfish behavior in their past.

I don't know why some men in long-term relationships think that women will continue to satisfy him when he makes little effort to satisfy her!! Don't they realize the scales always balance and what they think they are getting for nothing they pay for in the end. If I were a man I'd make sure I took the time to sexually satisfy my partner to maintain the sexual connection and not expect my partner to make her body parts available to me just for my pleasure. A man in control of himself is irresistible but a bj addict is kind of disgusting because they are so desperate and easy to manipulate.

Originally Posted by Mes_T

Why do some guys out there think that women want to give endless bjs (and vaccuum and cook and pick out their clothes)? Because some women out there, for whatever reason, go along with it, don't say no, don't stand up for what they want.

I think a lot of women were taught in some way or other to not have a voice. Well, some of us need to relearn how not only to be a woman but how to be a respected human being.

You want to do something, you do it. You don't want to do something, you don't do it. And then you consider compromises, within reason. Simple as that.

I think the giving endless bj's on demand is a stage for some woman in their sexual experimentation stage. They decide what they like and don't like. With maturity and experience some will stop because they probably have had too many bad experiences and too much entitled male behavior. It's human nature, no one, not even women, can keep giving and get nothing or even abuse in return. I think that some men think their masculinity is defined by how much pleasure they can extract from women especially bj and they get desperate to rack up inflated numbers to impress their buddies further fueling the male quest for bj's.

I've known women who say they love to do it and give them with no return satisfaction. I don't think they really enjoy giving for so little return it goes against human nature. But many men marry women based on getting lots of bj not realizing that they all human relationships are based on an exchange of satisfaction and he is using up a great deal of her love stores. Her enthusiasm is based on anticipation of having her needs met in kind. When they stop it's not a bait and switch as so many men think, it's a natural balancing of the give and take in a relationship.

It's a difficult a technique to master, it is usually very uncomfortable on the jaw, there are unpleasant smells, taste and textures. But after all that work, there is often a dissatisfied ungrateful man who may actually complain critique the performance of the giver if she will not swallow, act like a happy porn star, let them cum on her face. I will never understand the expectation for a show of enthusiasm, is connected with making a man feel loved. The complaints are a slap in the face. Moreover, it is amusing that men tell their partner that they need bj to feel loved. Like teenaged boys trying to convince a girl to have sex as a show of love. Why women are expected to give to show a man love is beyond my understanding.

That's a bunch of bs, love has nothing to do with manipulating a partner by guilting them into making themselves uncomfortable for the pleasure of another. If both partners are engaging in mutually satisfying sex then that maintains the emotional connection. That means that orgasms should not be out of balance. If one person is getting 5 orgasms for every one of the other, someone is going to become dissatisfied.

I wonder how many men realize that bj's are voluntary gifts that gets them a great deal of pleasure and the woman gets nothing but a sore jaw and the pleasure of dealing with warm sticky, bad tasting stuff shot down her mouth and maybe an ungrateful man dissatisfied with a less than sterling porn star. Of course the men who post with complaints about bj's are not the ones who appreciate their partners efforts. But from reading some of the post by men complaining about bj's, they are the ones who think they are entitled, can't figure out why though.

Men want a bj's because it is gives them pleasure with no effort on their part and being honest about it and grateful, will get a partner who is willing to give occasionally.