[mcfly]

Ok, here goes...

Hubby and I were together 10 years, kids, house, car etc. etc. A good life we thought at the time. Then, life happened. Between an chronic illness on my part, a surprise baby, and his father being sick and sadly passing away, the husband cracked.

He was taken care of for his whole life, never really had to worry completely as he always had someone there who would take care of it, whatever that may have been. Then in 5 months, the above life "" happened and he was being looked at to take care of stuff, or left to deal on his own with no support. He couldn't deal with it, and started to separate himself from the life he (we) had. The last two years have been devastating in more ways than one, on both of us.

He started to act like a guilty man, covering up a friendship with a woman whom he works with, lying to me about who all the calls on the now double-the-cost cell phone bill were to, saying that he knew there were problems with us and that he was trying, but never really did try, he started coming home later after work, and eventually just leaving for hours at a time.

Our fights got nasty, mean things were said (by me) and no emotion was shown (by him). We both got violent (the walls tell a story) and I did smack him a couple of times. Eventually, he told me he was leaving and going to share a place with the newly single woman friend.

He then realized that he couldn't afford to pay rent and child support so he asked if he could stay in our home, separate rooms. Worked for me as I needed assistance with the kids an the house. Well, we ended up sleeping together. With the pressure off, we both felt like the "we" part wasn't really done.

We started talking again, like when we first dated, honest and real. We looked at it as our past was dead, but the good parts of us are still here with the people we are now. We both realized we lost ourselves and each other when we became parents. We even went on a date, hadn't been out without a kid in years.

Then, the friend became a bit of an issue and we had a fight. He pulled away and we were awkward around each other. He told me that he had told him she was interested in him and wanted to start dating him. He slept with her when she showed up at his weekend job, and again the next day when she got him between work and picking up her kids. I warned him, before our problems became huge, that she was lining herself up for him and he didn't believe me. He liked the friendship because he has few friends and with her he says there were no life strings, they just hung out like buddies. I think he is now seeing how she has tugged his strings and gotten herself in the position to be a soft spot for him when he was vulnerable.

This is where it gets confusing for me. He says she doesn't know we were sleeping together and that we had started to explore the possibility of starting again. When he told me he had slept with her, I told him again that we needed to keep exploring the new us. We have. Again, good open communication about everything, including her,l tells me when she calls, texts, answers all my questions about her, and about us (I don't push that one too much as I know we are both still wondering about that one).

He doesn't know if he is interested in her as a person, or charged by the interest she has in him, or by the fact there is two women wanting him. He come home to me every night, kisses me goodnight and again in the morning before he leaves. She is pursuing him, and intensifying her actions. Fine by me, he doesn't like being pressured But, he isn't telling her to cool her jets or about us. And he doesn't know if he would sleep with her again...had the offer yesterday, but didn't take it as her kids would e ho

But still, I have doubts and concerns for myself. How much am I playing myself and letting him have his kicks, just because I still want him? Am I leaving myself up for complete heartbreak while giving them something to laugh at? When I think of it that way, there is nothing for him to play me for, we had already agreed on everything about the kids, there is no money, no things or anything to be here to get. I have to trust him for his actions and learn to trust what he says.

Most of all, how to I know I am not playing myself because I don't want to be alone and I want my best friend back ,my partner, the new people that we are becoming are the people we both now realize we have anted from each other for a lot of years.

How do I settle the uncertainty of my heart vs. the logic in my head?

Thanks for reading my novel....we may end up on Jerry Springer yet!

[WildChild]

Oh Dear. Only you know what you can deal with but he's having his cake and eating it too. WHY hasn't he told her that the two of you are exploring the continuation of your marriage? Have you been tested for STIs? He is putting you at risk. He may compliment himself that he is the man in two women's lives but really there is no guarantee that he is the only one in hers.

You've been through some rough stuff and marriages don't always survive it (mine didn't) but many do. What do you want? How do you want this to play out? Are you waiting for him to realize that you are the best thing for him? If he does will you really be able to deal with his vascilation and infidelity? What if she gets pregnant? If he decides to move on will you feel the two of you gave it your best? How can you if he is playing with two women? That doesn't sound like really trying.

Everyone is different and what is a deal breaker for one is no big deal for another. But put yourself and your children first, it doesn't sound like he is.

[mcfly]

Too much cake will make him fat...

This is where I am having my brain vs. heart issues..

He doesn't want to tell her because he feels that she will stop being his friend if she knew that we are seeing what-is-what with us. Let alone she may do the same if he were to tell her he wasn't interested in dating her. I have told him that by not telling her, he is making me the other woman now and that I won't be to her what she became in my marriage. He has to figure that one out himself and be willing to take the repercussions either way they may fall. He knows that if he were to say he wants to keep her in his life as an interest, that I can't live with that and would have to step back from us even being friends, at least until I could get adjusted to the idea.

I am watching out for myself in the practical aspects of this, STD testing, finances, separation agreements etc. The business part of all of this is the easy thing, it's the feeling and emotion and the grey areas that I can't settle with. I'm a bit of a control freak that way...gives me peace to know what all the possibilities could be, even if they don't happen. He had his bit clipped so there is no worry of pregnancy, but I have told him I don't trust what she says regarding her activity and will act accordingly.

I am willing to wait for him to work his way through his troubles and settle in with himself. I want him to realize he is the best thing for himself. Above all else, I am his friend and want the best for him. He can be a great person, he has never seen that in himself. I have seen him seem proud of himself when he is taking care of his business and find him more interesting and attractive now than I ever did. It doesn't hurt that is self confidence is making him 100% hotter than I ever noticed

We have talked about the kids, and the care of them is a different relationship between us. He is a great dad and takes care of them as much as his work schedule allows and he works a lot to be able take care of them financially, and with little change to their lives as may have had to happen if we split up.

If I had my way, we would be free just to explore the me and him without distraction. I have to give him some time and space to sort himself as he has never really been a quick draw in that department whereas I am a fast decision maker and have little time for doodling. I know him well enough to know that when pushed, he will just walk away rather than being forced into anything when he is unready.

We haven't made it more than three weeks since this odyssey began late January. We are just now hitting that mark and maybe I'm getting jittery about that. I have to settle myself and figure out where my boundaries are and what I am willing to live with and for how long. It helps to put it down (up?) in words and think in a line rather than having my thoughts bounce around like a pinball. I started to see a counselor last week, for issues regarding me and will be bringing up this pink elephant as well.

Patience (for myself firstly) is a virtue I need to work on.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

On one side of the coin, it is good that you both realised that through all the tough times, you were able to pull through to the extent of communicating, and expressing, and the realisation that dating is important, and that life is not all about housework, taking the garbage out but having fun.

On the other side, you need to nip this in the bud (the other woman), or else, he will have no choice but to see that he can in-deed, have "two" women, for a while, as you are accepting it, possibly hoping that he will see that it is you that he prefers to be with that was just a "thing"...

The problem is, is the more he realises that he can have both, purely by communicating with you, the more he will take.. It's only natural and who knows what will happen or how you will really feel when he makes love to you.

Fighting, walls smashed, quit that stuff, anger in that respect is wasted energy.

You need to decide how much you really "want" to remain with this man, if you do or if you are only doing so because 10 years is a long time, he was your "friend" and you don't really want to start all over again.

That's not the reason to stay.

You either, have to do things with him whereby you both start laughing, feel giddy again, enjoy each other, and give it say 2 months, without her to see, or you have to let him go his way, (not stay in your house), that's a cop out, if he wants to experiment at your expense, then he can't have the safety of not spending money either...

The way I see it, your kind of giving him everything he needs to establish what he wants at your expense.

CW

[mcfly]

I know I am giving him all the opportunities to do what he wants for himself how he wants and putting myself aside for him to do it.

But, I know him....when pushed, he walks. No matter what he feels for me, if I pressure him at all he will take that as me going back to what I was like during our troubled times and he doesn't want to be in that again. Neither do I. It's only been two weeks, not time at all for us to figure out us, or him to figure out him.

If all else was taken away, we are at a promising start. We flirt,tease, joke, hold hands, cuddle, sit on the couch together, kiss when we pass each other in the kitchen....all the kind of stuff we started out doing years ago and forgot to keep doing when we went on. we have gone out on dates, he's doing favours for me, he even went shopping with me for clothes, he has always hated doing that! He's called me during the day to say hi, he's asked me to help him with a few things that I used to take care of that are now his business but he is unsure of how to go about it. We are doing really well at starting as friends and seeing where it goes...except for "her".

It's a fine line to walk on...can't pressure the delicate nature of what we are or him or it all ends the second I start. I know we need time for ourselves. I know he needs to figure out what he wants.

But..I got a bit of help from some higher power...he got a new job, one that really makes him happy (he detested the one he has now). Best of all...it's away from her, and if she shows up to this one, he won't like it because he doesn't want to mess the chance up. And I know how to get her banned from the property

[WildChild]

Ummm, He doesn't want her to show up at the new job and doesn't want to mess the chance up? And you know how to get ther banned from the property? There isn't a problem with doing that? But you can't talk to him about her and he won't stop seeing her?

Ummmm OK, I don't quite get it but if it works for you....

[mcfly]

The banning is my devilish side, I have contacts at the corporation that owns the property. He doesn't want to go there. The nature of the job means she can be there around him, However it will become an issue for his job if he has a hanger-on with him while he works.

We talked about us last night, just about us. Gave me a good reference point to where he is and what he is feeling. He's scared that we are going to end up in the same rut of a place we were before. I don't want that either. I told him that I see our relationship as it was is dead and all I want to do is bring the good parts of ourselves forward with who we are now and establish something new. He had forgotten that part once it felt so natural for us to slip into this thing. He goes all in without thinking, and now sees that there are consequences for living that way. He did say that he was also worried that if we did start something new, that I would be the one to realize that he wasn't what I really wanted and that I would leave. That surprised me.

As for her, she is pressuring him in her pursuit and he is seeing that she isn't giving him the respect of knowing him as a friend and how he is. Whatever, that is her. We are still sorting out us, he will have to work out her. When (if?) we get to the point of being in a direction going towards being together, she will be something that will have to be dealt with so she doesn't come between us again. If actions speak louder than words, he has turned her offers down a few times this week and has come home to be with me (hanging out and getting to know one another again, he and I are taking it s-l-o-w-l-y in the sex department).

I feel more settled now that we talked about us and not about her. I had been making her our topic of conversation where maybe she only warranted a mention when needed.

We are going out tomorrow night for a short change of view. It might only be an hour, but it will be an hour away from the kids and the house and the chores etc. His suggestion even. That makes three dates in three weeks. Not too bad considering we hadn't been out as just us for almost 4 years.

[mcfly]

OK, for anyone that is following along...

He has, in his way, said that he isn't interested in dating or being with her, for anything other than friendship. He has also not told her that either. He is a very non confrontation (read, easier for him?) guy and would rather deal with everything this way. In some ways, I understand as he doesn't deal well with the stress of anything. In other ways, it would make me feel so much more at ease if an actual statement were made. He keeps pointing at his actions (coming home each night to me, dates with me, spending his few free hours with me and the kids, making steps forward on integrating himself back into family life). And yes, knowing him as I do, these are big things.

But of course, it still isn't an easy route. I had asked him something regarding some sexual talk we had, and if it were related to *any* thing other than us. He took that as an accusation and backed off as if I had the plague. I didn't name names....I actually asked in general terms to get a bit of an idea of where he is in terms of his sexual wants (me or her or just someone new). I tried to explain where I was coming from but at the time he didn't want to hear it. After a cooling off period (he took the kids out, alone, no one with them) he came back and again, in his way, said that he understood where I was coming from (trying to convince myself he should be trusted, to a point). He then went to work and said we would talk more later, that he was coming home tonite and made a point of saying he meant it.

Patience mcfly..it isn't going to be an easy or quick road.

[WildChild]

For someone who cheated, lied and manipulated he sure does a good job of putting you on the spot. He should busting his butt to earn your trust if he wants this marriage to recover. I hope this turns out to worth it for you and the kids. I can understand the need to feel like you gave him every chance, but in the proces I hope at some point he comes to value you and make the effort to meet your needs in the relationship.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

Be sure that you aren't doing a "win or lose" on this man.. Your sub-conscious purely wanting to win in other words and once achieved, you don't want anymore.

I can see where your coming from, you feel that he's putting in an effort to "see" about your relationship rather than walking away from it and perhaps never having the chance to return.

However, his comments of he only wants this woman as a friend but won't tell her? That doesn't make any sense to me at all and frankly non-acceptable as she is the cause of this situation to start with and therefore out of respect, he should not be friends with her.

I also know that you feel that you can convince him of this at a later date, once you have got him so called where you want him, together with your back up plan of banning her from this property if need be.. But then isn't that a card to play that is yours only and how would he feel if you actually did that and he found out?

Shouldn't marriage be about honesty?

Is he being honest? Are you if you ban her and don't tell him?

Dangerous waters I feel are going to get crossed.

CW