[redbull]

Its, actually, even more sad than if she was still not liking it, her organic feeling about it because its more like she just felt defeated by it, porn 1 - gf 0, and decided to resign herself to the fact that you will do it this way or that way. Which, honestly, speaks volumes of her love for you... so, at least you have that.

Even if that was the case it would be more like porn-1 Gf-234. I don't spend money on porn. I don't go to porn's house to watch movies. I don't look after porn and make sure she's okay. I don't listen to porn while it cries over the phone or listen to it complain about why this girl or that girl are backstabbing ****s etc etc etc

[Hopeless Dork]

When you said your girlfriend didn't like it at first, I assumed you meant she didn't like in a way that was relevent to this thread, my bad.

[redbull]

When you said your girlfriend didn't like it at first, I assumed you meant she didn't like in a way that was relevent to this thread, my bad.

Well, she never really specified. I guess since she didn't like the videos she might not have liked that I watch them. Then again, I hate those stupid Gossip Girl shows and I don't care if she watches them. But she never directly told me that. Either way, she'll sometimes watch it with me now. So I know she's okay with it now.

[StillLearnin]

If watching porn is the way men are wired, what did men do before porn was invented???

I personally like to watch it, it's a great fantasy. I recently got my wife to watch her first with me.

So, the way this thread seems to be going, since she now knows that I have had it (porn), that I masturbate, that we have porn available, it would be wrong of me to watch it and masturbate without her knowledge?

She's never wanted to know what I need to do to survive with limited sex. She's never wanted to deal with it. So I've always kept it secret. But now that she is more open to it, and more aware of sexual needs in general, would I be wrong to hide it (porn and masturbation) from her?

[stressed]

So, the way this thread seems to be going, since she now knows that I have had it (porn), that I masturbate, that we have porn available, it would be wrong of me to watch it and masturbate without her knowledge?

She's never wanted to know what I need to do to survive with limited sex. She's never wanted to deal with it. So I've always kept it secret. But now that she is more open to it, and more aware of sexual needs in general, would I be wrong to hide it (porn and masturbation) from her?

If she knows that you watch and she's ok with it, why would you have to hide it?

You were not sexually satisfied in the past, so you basically only had porn. The problem then was not whether you had to hide or not but why were you sexually dissatisfied and why wasn't she more open about sex.

If she's more aware of your needs and you're sexually satisfied, why do you still want to watch?

I think every case is different and we cannot generalize that either all men want/must watch porn, or that porn always harms relationships. There are fine details that make every case more or less porn-sensitive.

I don't think all men watch porn, or all women hate it, or that it's always done out of boredom, or it always affects relationships. We have to approach each case separately.

[redbull]

If watching porn is the way men are wired, what did men do before porn was invented???

Men were wired that way before porn was even invented. Before, they would look at other women they interact with and fantasize about them in their heads. Or they would look at paintings and drawings of naked women. Porn just puts it all in front of their faces, doing a better job than the customer's mind can at visualizing it.

So the short answer is: The same thing they do with porn now. Just on a different medium.

[StillLearnin]

So porn has always been here, probably since the first cave drawings... You're right about that. Now it's sooo easy to get on the internet. I've told my sons when I did the sex talk thing that when I was young I had to dumpster dive to dig out Playboy magazines that were thrown out in the bookstore dumpster. Now they can just do a Google search sitting in the comfort of our home and get anything they want. We do have parental controls, but they can get around that.

We're having sex a lot more now (2-3 times a week, yea!), and I'm trying to cut back on the amount of porn that I watch alone, because I am much more sexually satisfied. I introduced it to my wife recently to spice things up. After 20 years of vanilla (to me), infrequent (to me) sex, it's just another tool to help make things hotter in the bedroom.

And honestly, to the defense of the ladies that think of it as a problem, I can back you up on that. I have noticed that sometimes it takes me a lot longer to reach orgasm when I'm having real live interactive sex with my wife, and even sometimes lose the erection, and I directly contribute it to watching porn. It does affect a man. Desensitizes their brain and their penis.

[Hopeless Dork]

Either way, she'll sometimes watch it with me now. So I know she's okay with it now.

I use to watch it with my boyfriend with my heart in my gut the entire time. In fact I was the one that inniciated us watching it... because i use to see it on his computer all the time and I figured if you can't beat em' join em'. I wanted to at least be a part of things.

I resented him so much. Even though I never let on. When I'd go out on my own and guys gave me attention (i'd never cheat) but I relished it, and flirted back probably a lot more than I should of because I was in need of the validation that I was worthwhile sexually in the way that his occasional porn use was taking away from.

I finally realized I had to be true to myself and give him the opportunity to make me feel better... or else I feared that one day I would just up and leave and he wouldn't have even known why.

[Hopeless Dork]

Men were wired that way before porn was even invented. Before, they would look at other women they interact with and fantasize about them in their heads. Or they would look at paintings and drawings of naked women. Porn just puts it all in front of their faces, doing a better job than the customer's mind can at visualizing it.

So the short answer is: The same thing they do with porn now. Just on a different medium.

But fantasizing about women they knew ...caused them to be able to fantasize about a person, one with feelings and a life, one that they could see as more than just a 2d cardboard cut out sex object.

And using a variety of "porn", as in what was available from underwear catelogs to a late night aerobics infomercial or a playboy or occsional xxx flick caused them to be able to adapt to their stimulus, to reach sexual pleasure in a way that caused more fantasy than spoon fed, easy access internet porn. Which can dissassociate sexual release from intimacy thereby making intimacy including SEX with a partner... much more difficult in some cases... where they have trained their body to only respond to very specific criteria.

[brownlover]

Well, you're not enough to satisfy his need to look at a bunch of different women. But the point is that neither would the porn star. It's not a reflection on you specifically. It's just a characteristic of his and a lot of men's behavior.

Call me crazy, but if my man has a NEED to look at a bunch of different women, then he's in a relationship with the wrong dang person! I just can't be expected to sit back with approval while he oogles women! That's not how it works (at least not in my head). If he wanted variety, he shouldn't have gotten married. If he wanted to see all the boobs in the world, he shoulda stayed single and watched all the porn he wanted. I am not going to give in to this idea that men are just supposed to do it or are hardwired and can't help it! NOOOO. It's a choice and they can choose to stop. Most just dont!! Men are supposed to be with their women, make them feel special, and not be demeaning to them or their relationship by thinking it's ok to have that wandering eye (or imagination). He wants his cake and to eat it to and obviously want me to serve it and offer some milk. Well, my answer to that is NO. To the women that can do it, more power to you. But its not for me.

Now... if he wants to make it a part of our sexual experience... having it on in the background while foreplay is going on... that's a totally different situation. That'd be like bringing a toy to bed with you. We have several toys that we experiment with and wouldn't be afraid or ashamed to add more. But staring at a moniter, while you masterbate is not a real sexual experience. And like Still Learnin said... its nothing like it used to be. I remember the Penthouse days. I fear what my son will grow up to think about porn and sex since he has the gory stuff right at his fingertips. Will the next generation all be desensitized to porn?? What are they going to turn to for arousal??