[anonymouswhitefemale]

Heres another mid-20's male in a relationships opinion for you to ignore and disagree with.

Stone did the same thing as me. I signed up to this forum (actually my gf did but I stole her account) and was encouraged to post in some masturbation threads, as all I saw was one sided wishful thinking from women, who are unintentionally sabotaging their relationships.

I agree with everything stone says, and the fact that he says he doesn't look at women in the street (as I, and every other man does) is because he knows you have low self confidence. He is trying to ease this for you (as is other men who "give up" porn and masturbation for their partners). I'm almost willing to bet that the male partners of posters on these boards who insist they dont masturbate (as long as they're young), are just humoring you, and in thinking you've achieved a higher level of relationship you've just added a layer of deception, distrust, and the inability to cope with the person that your partner really is.

"However, I don't think one should fantasize about others if you're in a relationship. It's like you're getting the benefit of being in a happy, loving, good relationship, and yet mentally you're thinking about having sex with all these other women. You can't have your cake and eat it, too"

Ok, I'll forget for a minute all of the threads I've read on these boards in which female posters are encouraged and convinced there's nothing bad about fantasizing about other people EVEN WHILST HAVING SEX. Although this probably wasn't you that said that. If you really forced the world to be like that, as in a man in a relationship couldn't fantasise about someone else without ending the relationship, then you better become lesbian pretty fast, as you will NEVER see a relationship last more than a couple of weeks. Welcome to a loveless world .

Men think about having sex with women. That's the truth. That's the way nature has engineered us. We have overcome our genes to the extent that we will share our lives with just one partner, but you cannot tame our minds too. You cannot deny what we are. And neither can we. Your attidude to this is what decides how things turn out. You can be nurturing, supportive and understanding, or you can attack us. Attacking us will alienate yourself, and damage the relationship more than porn or masturbation ever will - because these things won't end a relationship, what will is your reaction.


I anticipate responses such as "you can't speak for all men" and "you cannot make generalisations" and "you're a twat". However, I think I know a good deal better about the nature of masculinity than someone of the other team, so to speak.

Please try to read this and understand instead of hating me, dismissing what I have to say and returning to your crusade to alienate your partners.


As others have said, this is YOUR issue, with YOUR self esteem. We go to extents to maintain this: "no I wasn't looking at her", "no your bum doesn't look fat in that" etc etc. However you are basically trying to change our very nature as individuals to massage your faulty ego. ]


I'm sorry for the upset that this post will probably cause.

[ChelseaRenee]

Heres another mid-20's male in a relationships opinion for you to ignore and disagree with.

Stone did the same thing as me. I signed up to this forum (actually my gf did but I stole her account) and was encouraged to post in some masturbation threads, as all I saw was one sided wishful thinking from women, who are unintentionally sabotaging their relationships.

I agree with everything stone says, and the fact that he says he doesn't look at women in the street (as I, and every other man does) is because he knows you have low self confidence. He is trying to ease this for you (as is other men who "give up" porn and masturbation for their partners). I'm almost willing to bet that the male partners of posters on these boards who insist they dont masturbate (as long as they're young), are just humoring you, and in thinking you've achieved a higher level of relationship you've just added a layer of deception, distrust, and the inability to cope with the person that your partner really is.

"However, I don't think one should fantasize about others if you're in a relationship. It's like you're getting the benefit of being in a happy, loving, good relationship, and yet mentally you're thinking about having sex with all these other women. You can't have your cake and eat it, too"

Ok, I'll forget for a minute all of the threads I've read on these boards in which female posters are encouraged and convinced there's nothing bad about fantasizing about other people EVEN WHILST HAVING SEX. Although this probably wasn't you that said that. If you really forced the world to be like that, as in a man in a relationship couldn't fantasise about someone else without ending the relationship, then you better become lesbian pretty fast, as you will NEVER see a relationship last more than a couple of weeks. Welcome to a loveless world .

Men think about having sex with women. That's the truth. That's the way nature has engineered us. We have overcome our genes to the extent that we will share our lives with just one partner, but you cannot tame our minds too. You cannot deny what we are. And neither can we. Your attidude to this is what decides how things turn out. You can be nurturing, supportive and understanding, or you can attack us. Attacking us will alienate yourself, and damage the relationship more than porn or masturbation ever will - because these things won't end a relationship, what will is your reaction.


I anticipate responses such as "you can't speak for all men" and "you cannot make generalisations" and "you're a twat". However, I think I know a good deal better about the nature of masculinity than someone of the other team, so to speak.

Please try to read this and understand instead of hating me, dismissing what I have to say and returning to your crusade to alienate your partners.


As others have said, this is YOUR issue, with YOUR self esteem. We go to extents to maintain this: "no I wasn't looking at her", "no your bum doesn't look fat in that" etc etc. However you are basically trying to change our very nature as individuals to massage your faulty ego. ]


I'm sorry for the upset that this post will probably cause.

Your post didn't upset me at all- It's fodder for discussion, that's always good.

OF COURSE my boyfriend looks at other women. I know this. Hell, we even look together. I don't care if he looks at other women on the street, we've talked about how he does and I jokingly make fun of him for it, because I don't care. In that sense, looking means nothing.

However, fantasizing is a different story. I am so, so, SO SICK of hearing the "but it's in our DNA!" excuse. SHUT UP! Jesus CHRIST. There's such a thing as evolution. Do we still run around naked? Do we have to go out in packs and hunt and gather? Uh. No. Because there's no need. Just like there's no need to go out and populate the earth on a whim, which is I assume what you're getting at with the whole "it's our genetic engineering" to desire many women. So your mind has conveniently given up our other "instincts", but of course when it comes to that, it's all still there, fresh as when that was actually a necessity. It's silly. If you want to go ahead and say, "we do it because we like it," fine. But own up- don't blame it on nature, because that has nothing to do with it at this point.

I'm not going to attack you. I think we can have an adult debate about this without either of us getting too worked up, and I enjoy these discussions, especially when you have someone with opposing ideas.

Look, the bottom line is, porn and fantasizing about other women are not a necessity, and are not anything like a reflex or something that is innate to you. It's a choice. And just like you make the choice to look at porn and fantasize about other women, other men can make the decision not to. Don't you think it's a little emasculating to basically allude to the idea that men have no control over that? Because I do.

Is it wrong, disturbing, and disgusting to fantasize about other women while in a relationship with one? In my opinion, absolutely not, and if it's encouraged and a non-issue within the bounds of your relationship, more power to you two. However, do you think it's too much to ask to want to be the only woman for the man who has chosen you, and who you have chosen? I don't. I know many others who don't. I'm not denying that in our culture it may be hard a hard thing to do to ignore other women sexually, meaning during masturbation or sex- as I've said, I see nothing wrong with and actively encourage him looking, since we have fun comparing them! But in my opinion, it's worth the effort to TRY to ignore them in that sexually capacity. I fail to see how it would harm your relationship with your spouse, and can see at least some good that would come out of it- Imagine how amazing your spouse would feel knowing they were the only one who "did it" for you, sexually. She'd feel empowered, sexier, bolder, more confident. I'm not saying she's not all of these things already, I'm sure she is! But to be your man's one and one in the sex department...It'd sure help.

[rcoreyus]

Nothing should be too embarrassing that you can't share it with a spouse. And if your spouse feels they have some embarrassing fantasy that they don't want to share with you, that's a huge issue- one of trust AND sexuality.

I agree with you that nothing SHOULD be to embarrassing to share with a spouse. Sadly, in many cases spouses will reactly very badly to some things. Sometimes it is the "land mine game". How do you feel about "X". "sounds like fun". How about trying "Y". "OK", Maybe we should try "Z" "oh you sick $$$$, that's disgusting. Why do you think I would want that".

[ChelseaRenee]

I agree with you that nothing SHOULD be to embarrassing to share with a spouse. Sadly, in many cases spouses will reactly very badly to some things. Sometimes it is the "land mine game". How do you feel about "X". "sounds like fun". How about trying "Y". "OK", Maybe we should try "Z" "oh you sick $$$$, that's disgusting. Why do you think I would want that".

I can't imagine anyone doing that! I mean, I suppose there are some women (or men) out there who would, but I can't imagine why. If it's not your thing, say so. But I couldn't imagine calling the man I loved sick. Talk about creating walls and distrust in a relationship.

[rcoreyus]

I can't imagine anyone doing that! I mean, I suppose there are some women (or men) out there who would, but I can't imagine why. If it's not your thing, say so. But I couldn't imagine calling the man I loved sick. Talk about creating walls and distrust in a relationship.

What if he said "lets watch a porn flick together"? (to tie it into the other thread here).

Most of the people on this forum are quite open minded - at least in their anonymous persona. Its easy to forget that there are still a lot of people out there who are easily shocked. I am pretty open minded, but there are things that shock me - that others consider OK.

Communication in a relationship is important - but often lacking.

[ChelseaRenee]

What if he said "lets watch a porn flick together"? (to tie it into the other thread here).

Most of the people on this forum are quite open minded - at least in their anonymous persona. Its easy to forget that there are still a lot of people out there who are easily shocked. I am pretty open minded, but there are things that shock me - that others consider OK.

Communication in a relationship is important - but often lacking.

Actually, I've suggested that, so I know I'd do that, but I know a lot of women who wouldn't. To me, that's pretty minor compared to SOME things I've heard of men asking for, but I'm sure there's a women out there who ranks that right up there with, say bestiality or something. To each their own, but still, I think disgust is a pretty cruel way to react to someone opening up to you.

[Fallen1]

I think disgust is a pretty cruel way to react to someone opening up to you.

True. We all want honesty and communication in our relationships. If we were to have that kind of reaction (disgust) to something our partners said I believe that it would only discourage them to communicate with us in the future.

[sourpuss]

I have no problem with masterbation....and porn to an extent. But there comes a breaking point where it effects the relationship. My current relationship has completely fizzled out because my guy watched so much porn and spent so much time fantasizing/talking with other women online that he could no longer enjoy sex with me. (or perform for the matter).
I had perfectly normal self esteem until this relationship. But his constant pursuing of other woman and other means of satisfying himself made me feel, for the first time in my life, completely inadequate.

So at what point is it ok and not ok for a guy to fantasize and please his own needs. I feel like my relationship got to that point because I tried for a long time to be open-minded about it.

I always thought the women on here complaining about their husbands and boyfriends porn and masterbation just needed to lighten up, but now I can kind of see where they are coming from.

[anonymouswhitefemale]

OF COURSE my boyfriend looks at other women. I know this. Hell, we even look together. I don't care if he looks at other women on the street, we've talked about how he does and I jokingly make fun of him for it, because I don't care. In that sense, looking means nothing.

At least you don't think he never even looks at another woman.

I am so, so, SO SICK of hearing the "but it's in our DNA!" excuse. SHUT UP! Jesus CHRIST. There's such a thing as evolution. Do we still run around naked? Do we have to go out in packs and hunt and gather? Uh. No. Because there's no need. Just like there's no need to go out and populate the earth on a whim, which is I assume what you're getting at with the whole "it's our genetic engineering" to desire many women.

Okay, if you rewind, say 10,000 years - which is a blink of an eye evolutionarily speaking (insufficient time for any significant change), the world was exactly the way our programming has prepared us for. We didn't have society feeding and protecting us, nor were the lifespans and death rate anything like they are now. Humans as we know it have not evolved recently (since the change), as there has been no time. The only thing that we have developed is the ability to control objects around us. That doesn't change the configuration of our synapes or hormone levels or anything else like that. We are still over 99% of what we were when we were spreading our seed in the hope our tribe may yet live on. And as for your point on hunting, of course we haven't been able to get rid of that genetic trait... Why do you think men fight so much and seek trilling events, play sport etc etc.

I'm sorry, but I'm absolutely unwilling to accept that we have physically evolved in as short term as you are thinking. So you may be tired of the "it's our genetic programming" excuse, but even if you are tired of an answer it can still be the truth.

So your mind has conveniently given up our other "instincts", but of course when it comes to that, it's all still there, fresh as when that was actually a necessity. It's silly. If you want to go ahead and say, "we do it because we like it," fine. But own up- don't blame it on nature, because that has nothing to do with it at this point.

Don't you think it's a little emasculating to basically allude to the idea that men have no control over that?

It is of course, a belittling feeling to know that we are so controlled by what and who we are. It is, however, the truth. We are all undeniable constructs of our genetic code and our upbringing and influnces. We follow a formula. We think we are free, but what we are not free from is ourselves, and we overestimate our ability to act outside of the confines of our already existing behavioural patterns (and how about the fact that we make decisions half a second before we realise we actually make a decision!). For example, a woman who is taught sex is evil when she's a kid will likely grow up fantasing about being raped, as she wants the choice of sex to be made for her, so she doesn't feel guilty about it. She thinks this is her choice. It is not. I also call your attention to a birth defect where instead of XX for female and XY for male, a child can be born XYY. People and animals with this condition are uncontrollably violent and sexual. We ARE the product of our components. We could spend all of our effort fighting what we ourselves are, but in my opinion that isn't a good way to live. I think to have the best shot at happiness you have to acknowledge what you are.

Look, the bottom line is, porn and fantasizing about other women are not a necessity, and are not anything like a reflex or something that is innate to you. It's a choice. And just like you make the choice to look at porn and fantasize about other women, other men can make the decision not to. Because I do.

You're a man? I didn't think you were.....................
Our habits are innate to us. A lot more so than you think. SOME men will stop that, mainly old or religious types. The exception that proves the rule, so to speak.

Imagine how amazing your spouse would feel knowing they were the only one who "did it" for you, sexually. She'd feel empowered, sexier, bolder, more confident.

Okay, and this is where the ego massaging comes into play. Without a HEAVY emotional bond, and probably an older person, or a VERY VERY VERY beautiful woman, that just isn't going to be the case. We do our best to make you think it is, but the sad truth is that it is not. So in my eyes, it comes down to turning your back on the genes you were born with, in order to bow down to someone elses opinion and massage their self esteem.



And seperately, in regard to opening up about sexual desires, women are far more judgemental, it's like playing russian roulette.

[ChelseaRenee]

No! I'm a girl. I mean I DO THINK they can make the decision, not that I DO make the decision and am a man. For now it's late, and I'll respond to it all tomorrow, just wanted to clear that one up.