[KD01]

When we first started going out, my boyfriend was frankly kind of an ******* to me. He had a long-term female best friend (20?F) he'd known throughout college. They both had on-and-off feelings for one another which didn't result in much of anything. While they never dated, but they did share a kiss which he previously noted was "one of the most amazing moments" of his life up there with a childhood birthday he spent with his now divorced parents. Wow... "It was the best kiss I've EVER had." (because it was so passionate)...

When we first started going out, he'd moved away from the area she lived in after deciding that he wanted a big change in life and was stuck waiting around on her. He claims he was no longer "in love" with her during this period, but was still in the process of "moving on"... whatever that means. He now says he probably wasn't really in love with her, because he didn't have much else going on in his life whenever he was attracted to her. When he did, those feelings would naturally go away, and he believes true loving feelings aren't as wishy-washy as that. He thinks he was just mixing up feelings of familiarity and "family" with attraction, because "she's not even my type"...

I have to admit I've always been jealous of this girl. She's been around him for so long, and was obviously a point of huge obsession for him. I tried to get past it by being her friend, but quite a few things got in the way....

1) I stumbled across some conversations he had with her when we first started dating which basically said:
-I can't break up with her, she's too broken.
-She's crazy.
-It's not easy "living" with her like it was with you. (This was after a long visit).
-I get bored and think about other things during sex. However, I probably wouldn't do that if I thought she was super attractive... but she's always nagging me for it. It's a nuisance.
-She's more in love with me then I am with her.

As for the above conversation I bulleted, he said that it was "all bull****". He didn't mean any of it. He was just overwhelmed by the long visit, and wasn't fully prepared for the reality of what it meant to have a serious girlfriend. He hadn't dated in awhile, and had this habit of venting whenever he was angry. It wasn't true. It's really hard for me to believe none of it is true when it's everything I am cripplingly insecure about. I haven't been able to believe 100% that I'm super attractive to him ever since. He says it can't possibly be true, because he's the one that usually initiates sex all of the time, he's asked for naughty pictures of me, etc - why would he do all of that if he didn't think I was attractive? OK... He also said: "If I really thought those things, don't you think they would've come up more often? They didn't! They only came up that one time, and only because I was so upset."

2) He also had this disgusting habit of copy-and-pasting all our fights to his friends for "advice". Once I told him that **** was NOT ACCEPTABLE and DISRESPECTFUL to me, he hasn't done it since (supposedly). However, I can't help but feel really hurt and violated. If he wanted me to get along with his friends, why would he bad mouth me like that? But... "I say good things too! I just wanted a second opinion! It wouldn't bother me if you copy and pasted me, so I assumed it wouldn't bother you either."

3) When we first started going out, he made this big spiel about how he would NEVER get rid of his best friend. HIS FAMILY WOULD ALWAYS COME FIRST OVER ME, and SHE'S FAMILY. "Stop making this just about her! It's not just her, it's ALL MY FAMILY." Bull****... there was something special about her. I automatically felt like I could never compare to her, ever. She was number one, and I was number two, and I just had to deal with that hierarchy in his life.

Oh, but it's okay, because "I'm not attracted to her anymore"... It was always an 'us' versus 'me' thing. "You're just not like US..." He talked about her ALL THE TIME. It was maddening. This was also the period where he'd get irritated at me a lot over little things. It isn't like that now, but I still feel like he was upset that I just wasn't her. I spoke to her once, and she even said (without prompting): "It must be hard having him talk about me all the time." SHE KNEW the hold that she had over him. That just makes it worse! I mean, why would a girl who isn't interested in you romantically and isn't especially close with your family ADD YOUR ENTIRE FAMILY on Facebook? He says that's not weird... I disagree.

4) That was a lie. He was still wildly attracted to her. He posted her pictures on /r/Dopplebangher (a "subreddit" on the internet where you can post someone's pictures for others to find porn stars that are look-alikes) around our three month mark. Yay... I thought I was on my own reddit account and was looking through my liked pages when... oops, stumbled across a page he'd "liked" from his own throwaway. This ****ing crushed me. I packed up all my belongings and was prepared to leave. (Note: We don't live together, but we're LDR, so I was visiting). I ended up seeing friends in the area, so that gave him time to beg and plead me to stay with him.

He wrote this long post about how he'd lied to me... he was attracted to a lot of his female friends (of which he has a majority), and had often made it a habit to masturbate to the thought of them (but not pictures). It "didn't mean anything", and it "wasn't only her", but she was his "most attractive friend"... but hey! "I don't have that many friends!" That's comforting... I asked what was the most attractive about her, and he says "her personality"... I'm crying right now as I write this, because it still bothers me SO MUCH. He says he never actually returned to that post, because he was disgusted with himself. He masturbated, and never thought about it again. He says it isn't like he is fantasizing about having sex with her - because he just doesn't think about those things ever, he isn't the type to put himself in the role as he watches porn - but that she (or other friends) would just "come to mind" occasionally when he was horny.

He tried to comfort me by saying it wasn't like he was thinking about anything in particular about her or anybody else. They'd just "come to mind"... but "I only think about other people occasionally when I'm horny. You're the only person who thinking about specifically can /get/ me horny."

5) He says I'm the "most attractive" person to him, by default, because I'm the one that he's with. It's automatically a standard that other people can't meet, because we have a history, memories together, and a romantic connotation that other people don't have. They might be physically attractive, and he might have "crushes" on them, but they're all superficial things. I'm physically attractive, and emotionally attractive, and we're together. It's "much more" then anything could possibly compare to. And besides, "I don't compare you to anyone or anything, so why do you compare yourself"?
I think it's understandable why I'd compare myself. I jut can't /stop/ at this point. I feel like if I was the MOST ATTRACTIVE then why wouldn't he have posted me to that subreddit? Why wouldn't he want porn that resembled me? "I already had some..." yeah, whatever. I don't think I look anything at all like his "type". When we first got together, he talked RELENTLESSLY about how hot different celebrities were, blahblahblah... of which I look NOTHING like. I don't even dress in the "style" of clothing that he likes.

So, naturally, I feel both slovenly and unattractive by comparison. Why would he date someone that is SO opposite of his type? He says it's because he doesn't have a type. He was lonely, and constructed a bunch of superficial things that he liked from people he'd never meet. It has no bearing whatsoever on me, and that his preferences naturally change to suit the person that he's with.

"Like, I originally liked thicker hair... you have thin hair. I love it now!" or "I usually liked smaller asses, but I'm OBSESSED with your ***. I absolutely love it." or... you name it. But I still feel like he'd much rather be with some dyed-hair hipster girl then me. I know his type so well that I can see girls when I go out that look like the type he'd drool over, and it just makes me sad. I feel like I'm always the one people settle for. I'm never just what people naturally want. I'm not nearly as attractive as his best friend or his exes. I just feel like I'm the nice girl he's with because his best friend didn't want him.

6) He's changed a lot. He says he had a wall up due to bad experiences. A lot of his exes cheated on him, and then his best friend "lead him on"... He had a ****ty one night stand, met a girl who flaked out on him all the time, and eventually he just stopped looking, and then he met me. And to his credit, ever since he let that wall down... he's been WONDERFUL. But the damage is done, and I'm having a hard time getting over it. Most of these things happened within three months, and we're almost a year in, and I'm still very crippled by these things. I should be over it by now, right? But I'm not.

After discovering his post to that subreddit, he volunteered to stop talking to his best friend. This is a girl that had been there for him through A LOT. Her family had become very close to him. He was even there for her when her Dad died, and lived with her family for a short period during that time to support them. They just have a lot of history, but ultimately she could only see him as a brother. She was very supportive of our getting together, but the fact that he could obviously not /fully/ move on from his attraction to her was too much for me to take. Despite him originally saying he'd never give her up, he did voluntarily.

He stopped talking about celebrities when I asked. He took down the onslaught of girly wallpapers he'd had, threw out the mousepad of his "celebrity crush"... He's been amazing. Once he let down that wall, the amount of love he's given me has been breathtaking. He says - "Who am I with? Who do I talk to everyday? You! So, who gives two ****s about people who are no longer in my life? You are now, and you should enjoy it." He even says he's stopped thinking about his friends during masturbation. "It didn't mean anything, so it's not that hard to stop doing." And not to be TMI, but there's one time where he came without much attention just because of how "hot" he found me. But I still can't get over all this ****...

[jen1447]

This is a lot to respond to. Just a few things ....

First, this girl was his first real love? That would explain a lot. Your first always has that shine of being "the one," no matter if they really were or not and chances are they definitely weren't. They still almost always have a legendary status tho anyway, so you're competing against a legend. That's a tough fight.

1) I stumbled across some conversations he had with her when we first started dating which basically said:
-I can't break up with her, she's too broken.
-She's crazy.
-It's not easy "living" with her like it was with you. (This was after a long visit).
-I get bored and think about other things during sex. However, I probably wouldn't do that if I thought she was super attractive... but she's always nagging me for it. It's a nuisance.
-She's more in love with me then I am with her.

As for the above conversation I bulleted, he said that it was "all bull********************************". He didn't mean any of it. He was just overwhelmed by the long visit, and wasn't fully prepared for the reality of what it meant to have a serious girlfriend. He hadn't dated in awhile, and had this habit of venting whenever he was angry. It wasn't true. It's really hard for me to believe none of it is true when it's everything I am cripplingly insecure about. I haven't been able to believe 100% that I'm super attractive to him ever since. He says it can't possibly be true, because he's the one that usually initiates sex all of the time, he's asked for naughty pictures of me, etc - why would he do all of that if he didn't think I was attractive? OK... He also said: "If I really thought those things, don't you think they would've come up more often? They didn't! They only came up that one time, and only because I was so upset."

My intuition tells me he's lying. The truth is always simple. "Did you mean those things?" "No." Truth. "Did you mean those things?" "Well baby, it's like this, one day when I was just a boy, I saw a woman in a green dress and a floppy sun hat ...." (ten paragraphs follow) Lie.

2) He also had this disgusting habit of copy-and-pasting all our fights to his friends for "advice". Once I told him that ******************************** was NOT ACCEPTABLE and DISRESPECTFUL to me, he hasn't done it since (supposedly). However, I can't help but feel really hurt and violated. If he wanted me to get along with his friends, why would he bad mouth me like that? But... "I say good things too! I just wanted a second opinion! It wouldn't bother me if you copy and pasted me, so I assumed it wouldn't bother you either."

Pretty lame, no matter what the reason.

3) When we first started going out, he made this big spiel about how he would NEVER get rid of his best friend. HIS FAMILY WOULD ALWAYS COME FIRST OVER ME, and SHE'S FAMILY. "Stop making this just about her! It's not just her, it's ALL MY FAMILY." Bull********************************... there was something special about her. I automatically felt like I could never compare to her, ever. She was number one, and I was number two, and I just had to deal with that hierarchy in his life.

That's a crappy thing to say but at least he was being honest.

As to the rest, you seem to basically be enumerating all the things about the situation that make up the impression of what you already know - you're not #1. Seems pretty clear, and your own intuition is telling you in no uncertain terms. Is there anything tying you to thus guy besides good old fashioned romance and heartache? I think you should push your way thru the fog and do what you already know you need to - move on.

[effy2014]

Jen has summarized his past actions very well. I would only add one thing about #1 -- it really does not matter whether or not he was telling the truth. Even if he was lying to his "best friend" the reason was to get her to love him (in other words, she's nothing like you and even though I'm with her, I still want you).

The way you describe him, he is an incredibly immature boy who has made you feel insecure about who you are. Not a great start to a relationship. Why you didn't leave him then is a mystery.

The question I have is whether there is a path for redemption. To borrow a phrase from AA, your BF has been clean and sober for 9 months. Yet, your mind dwells on the indignities you suffered during the first three months that you were together. He is with you, the sex is good and he appears to have given up his former best friend and his celebrity crushes.

You need to figure out, and quickly, what it is that he can do . . . or the two of you can do together . . . to get past your insecurities in the relationship. Very real and very concrete steps (ie, "he needs to treat me better isn't an answer -- it has to be specific). If you can't completely get rid of the anger and resentment you feel now, the relationship will be forever tarnished. Pack up and leave.

If you can figure it out, you and your BF need to talk and you need to tell him what must be done. For your part, if he does them, the you have to be able to put this all behind you. If he doesn't care enough to take the steps, then you have your answer.

Of course, only you know what you need. If you need help, go see a therapist for a few sessions to help you sort through this. He may give you a different perspective on all of these issues.

Best of luck to you.

[KD01]

First, this girl was his first real love? That would explain a lot. Your first always has that shine of being "the one," no matter if they really were or not and chances are they definitely weren't. They still almost always have a legendary status tho anyway, so you're competing against a legend. That's a tough fight.

No, this girl wasn't his first love. They never even dated. He's had a few serious girlfriends. I think he just was fixated on her, because he'd known her for so long and felt "stuck". We met just when he'd made the decision to move out of the state and therefore leave her behind. So, he was still dealing with the ramifications of that decision.

My intuition tells me he's lying. The truth is always simple. "Did you mean those things?" "No." Truth. "Did you mean those things?" "Well baby, it's like this, one day when I was just a boy, I saw a woman in a green dress and a floppy sun hat ...." (ten paragraphs follow) Lie.

And, he did originally just say "no" to that. I pushed for more information, because I just didn't get it. He was like - "I don't know what to tell you. It's just a lie, nothing more or less." However, after I pushed a bit, he gave me more reasons.

If you can figure it out, you and your BF need to talk and you need to tell him what must be done. For your part, if he does them, the you have to be able to put this all behind you. If he doesn't care enough to take the steps, then you have your answer.

I think the problem is we've had a lot of talk, and he's made EVERY SINGLE CHANGE that I've asked for. He's working so hard. That's why I feel he really is worthy of redemption. He's been absolutely wonderful. He never talks to his "best friend" anymore. Ever. And the one time she reached out to him, he let me know RIGHT AWAY without responding to her first. The last time we spoke about it, he actually broke down sobbing and was very remorseful... I think that's what I needed from him - true and absolute understanding of the seriousness of the situation, validating my feelings and thoughts completely, etc. So, I feel a lot better about things. I'm actually at his place now, visiting... and I just think I need to forgive him. People make mistakes. He was in a rough place in life when we met and so was I. We both had our guard up. We both have history. However, he's treated me like a princess since then... I really am #1 to him NOW, even if I wasn't then. I don't think it was really about his "best friend", and more about some lingering trust issues he'd had. Girls have treated him badly in the past. And even that first thing - the kiss - wasn't even something he had said after meeting me. It was something I stumbled across. I think I just have been on the war path looking for things to nurture my own insecurities... How do I stop that? I do believe he is worthy of trust. He's bent over backwards to make amends to me. He's become the man I needed him to be.

[effy2014]

Fabulous. Best of luck.

[KD01]

So, you think given that, there's nothing to worry about??

[effy2014]

Unless you believe that he is a con man, he has done what you have requested. You are a little wiser now and know the signs if he is back sliding.

Communication is what keeps a relationship together. If the two of you work on it . . . if he feels safe and encouraged to tell you his needs, desires and feelings and you do the same, things can work. Check in with each other, fine tune when needed. But communicate all of the time.