[Wednesday L.F.]

I’d like to get everyone’s input on approaching strangers to ask them out (or get their digits to ask them out later). This used to be very common behavior, but there’s a thinking among younger people that women in particular don’t care for this trend and wouod rather not be bothered at the gym, bus stop, etc.

meanwhile, many men believe they have the right to a woman’s time and attention—and even kindness—without ever realizing that these situations can turn dangerous.

Do you ever approach strangers for dates? Do you enjoy being approached this way?

[JonnyR]

Oh man...don't even get me started on this topic!

It's become an epidemic whereby whenever women see a man approaching (yeah, I'm talking about me mostly, but also it seems the majority of other men also experience this) they immediately walk faster, put their head down, pretend they're looking at their phone, or look directly past you -- single or not.

This is without any behavior that would indicate we're making a move, planning to make a move, or even noticing them; it's almost preemptive.

And honesty, it feels ****ty.

It's like I'm being thrown into a bucket of stalkers, botherers, annoyers, or generally unacceptable men's behaviors.

Not to mention how this just KILLS serendipity, and the natural magic or grace that can happen at any moment, meeting a stranger and hitting it off.

It also seems that after COVID this behavior has gotten worse -- I used to always say hello and have a lot more interactions with anyone -- men and women included -- before COVID turned people into introverts, social avoiders, or awkward conversationalists.

This also includes the fact that most people now preclude these types of encounters by always looking at their phone (especially in the gym between sets or while doing cardio), having their earphones in, or otherwise filling every single quiet moment with something that takes their time and attention.

I would LOVE to have more cool and impromptu interactions with the women at the gym, especially those who are EXACTLY the type of woman I want to meet (and I bet they feel the same about the general type of person who works out and prioritizes health).

Alas, it's become this weird thing where you see the same person day after day -- yet never say hello, never even know their name...I mean, when I see other dudes at the gym day after day, after a while, we nod, we say hi, and usually wind up talking and getting to know each other.

I get the safety aspect -- I want to acknowledge that -- and the world is very different for a woman than a man (nobody approaches us! LOL almost regardless of how good looking we are), however, I don't see how life is better for you when you've lost touch with your feminine energy and a free spirit that is transcendent, easy going, kind, warm and naturally attracts good energy.

[atskitty2]

When I was younger, I approached guys if I felt the urge. It was generally well received. That was a lifetime ago tho'. Would never do that now. I was open to advances from an interested guy. I was pretty chill.

As I got older, and was back into dating, I didn't do that quite so much. I also was much less tolerant of men approaching me in random places. I did prefer dating apps like Bumble that required the woman make the first move. For me, things became much more compartmentalized. At work, when I was 28, I was always thinking of people, outgoing, doing all the social things all the time. Now, I really get irritated if a man starts to hit on me in a non-social environment. Not only am I in a committed relationship now, I am just doing my shopping, or walking the dogs, or paying for parking. Leave me tf alone!

So, I think it is a risk you take. Pretty low stakes, usually, but most people at this point, even the young singles, are not generally open to their personal time and space being encroached upon by uninvited advances.

[JonnyR]

Sadly, this is true.

I once went on a date with someone who complained that she was always being hit on at Whole Foods!

Something to the effect of "Why do guys always talk to me when I'm out at Whole Foods..." as if she was being tortured and it was such a life burden to be thought of as so attractive that men would just come after her...

It was actually pretty disgusting to me, if I'm being honest, and reeked of entitlement.

I thought to myself, you poor thing, you get hit on when you're at Whole Foods...what a bummer.

I went on to explain to her 2 important facts:

1) It isn't easy and requires a LOT of courage to talk to someone in public like that (see comment above), and if men had to wait for women to initiate, nothing would ever happen

2) There will come a day when she'll wish men still hit on her at Whole Foods or anywhere (the classic story...)

3) This doesn't happen to every woman

Often in a paradox of choice, we miss the forest for the trees and often think we've got all the time in the world, and the universe will just present us with someone out of thin air, but as I read more and more dating advice for the modern world, it seems that we're actually returning to a state whereby it is now necessary and encourages to get off the dating apps, and create FRICTION in your life to actually run into and meet people while out and about.

The loneliness epidemic with millennials, Gen Z and beyond is showing that there needs to be a change here -- we're social creatures by default, and retreating to our phones and homes isn't solving anything, and lessening our society.

[Wednesday L.F.]

When someone is at a club or a singles event, it might make sense to approach a stranger because you find them nice looking. But treating a grocery store, library, or workplace like your personal dating site is wild—and the idea that women should be grateful for the attention is…really something.

I wonder, and please pardon my sexism, if some fellas realize how men act when they think ppl aren’t watching. I worked at Whole Foods in my 20s and got hit on by old men every day. That’s annoying enough, but after polite refusals I’d often be met with variations on “you really think you’re pretty enough to be turning men down” or outright anger at being turned down by a fat girl, I decided not to entertain any of it. But then I’m seen as cold, rude, unwelcoming, etc etc. in bars, I’ve had drinks thrown at me, been called foul names…just for telling a complete stranger I didn’t want to give him my personal info.

I’m sure men reading this think ‘well of course that’s bad. Men shouldn’t behave like that. I know I don’t.’ And maybe that’s true. But we can’t tell just by looking at you if you’re going to fly off the handle when we point out we’re just trying to get groceries and wanna be left alone…not to mention the overall ickiness of asking someone out because you like their appearance at a glance.

[atskitty2]

And, in fairness, it can often be a matter of the way someone approaches. I once had a man essentially follow me all over the grocery store, monitoring everything I put in my cart. I had noticed his presence and apparent pre-occupation with me and was just monitoring him - ya never know if they'll follow you out and do something completely inappropriate. But no, he eventually orchestrated a cart crash and immediately began commenting on my purchases and something I'd done in the dairy section. Cute guy, but absolutely creep-o vibes and I don't remember if I told him off, or ignored and moved on, but that is NOT the way.

Most men have no idea how to be respectful, and come on without coming off as a weirdo. And many of us women have become conditioned to expect the worst, because it is so frequently the case that we are treated poorly.

So, I don't disagree with you JonnyR about the social problems of keeping to ourselves, especially after the pandemic. But a lot of this is a safety issue for women. It isn't entitlement to want to have your personal time and space respected. Maybe your friend really does sort of take for granted that she's so hot, and men will always be after her, but most of us just wanna get our groceries and go home, without any interruptions. Some women, myself included, will even try to avoid running into people we know. I just wanna do what I went there to do, and go home. Being introverted, some days I just don't want to talk to anyone but my partner.

There are some creepy men, creepy women and assault is a thing. It happens, and we all have a heightened instinct to protect ourselves these days.

[JonnyR]

I guess, as the saying goes, "timing is everything"...

I DO know and realize that most men have NO game, are fairly intimidated to talk to anyone (let alone a good-looking woman), and don't initiate as a result.

That leaves the guys that are pros/cons -- pun intended.

The men that like the "challenge" or don't take no for an answer or give off the "creep" vibes...

That's sad and unfortunate.

I know if nice dudes (and I count myself as one with a high EQ radar, knowing when a woman is "closed for business" and when she is more open) would break out of their shells, this perception and reality might be entirely different.

It saddens me greatly that we're at such a juncture in our history (or has it always been this way, unfortunately?), that you can't have a civil, polite, and maybe somewhat flirty conversation with a total stranger if/when it's appropriate or they give you the opening.

My usual rule of thumb in these situations (and they are pretty nerve wracking for the guy too!) is first feel the vibe and energy -- some women are completely CLOSED ("leave me alone, just here to get my **** and get out; I'm married/in a relationship...etc") and those are obvious non-starters for high EQ guys.

And in the situations where there is an opening (a smile, SHE started the conversation, etc.) my other rule is if/when we talk, does she KEEP talking?

If she's quick to get in and out and says simple one-word answers and obvious negative body language, I let it go quickly -- but if she keeps talking, asking me questions, etc, that's a clear opening for me.

I think the rules of engagement are pretty straightforward -- and this goes for anyone -- even the annoying person on the plane that sits next to us and starts talking when we have our headphones on and are looking out the window!

My theory -- and you guys can chime in with your thoughts -- is that if MORE nice, civil, and respectful dudes approached women in civil, respectful and clearly boundaried ways (and let's be honest, if a guy is super ****ing hot, it also helps!), I sincerely believe this wouldn't be such a problem.

Anyway, the ultimate answer to the thread "Is approaching strangers even ok" -- for me, the answer is and always will be YES -- with the caveats noted.

[atskitty2]

Yeah, I don't disagree with that at all-that if more of the "approaches" were not in disrespectful, demeaning and an overly forward manner, most of us would be more open to a conversation. That's for a new generation tho, I think. It will be many years before any woman I know will change her mind about this.

[Wednesday L.F.]

And if a polite refusal doesn't turn them into a Tasmanian devil.

[marjbenares]

The truth is, I think the dating culture and what is acceptable and not acceptable has really changed over the years and I think many women just feel uncomfortable meeting random strangers in public. Somehow, many people find it more comfortable meeting online and building a relationship there first before meeting in person whereas if you think about it, it might actually much more dangerous. You won't have kids talk to strangers online, why would we be comfortable doing so?