[jns]

My parents (mother and stepfather) have been married ten years longer than us. They're probably our closest companions and the relationship I'm most familiar with besides my own. They did have a physical incident a few years after they married. What they agree on is that my stepfather pushed her. He says she got physical first. She didn't seem to disagree, but she left him anyway. She wanted to make it clear that she wasn't tolerating a man abusing her. They got back together and as far as I know, that has never happened again. My mother told me after she left my natural father, that she's easy-going, but she's not going to have any man run over her. She's shown me that with her actions and I respect her deeply for living it all my 42 years.

This quote from Stillness makes me ask a question: Why is it more acceptable for a woman to physically abuse a man than a man to physically abuse a woman in our supposedly equal society? She wouldn't tolerate a man abusing her but he was supposed to tolerate her abusing him? Society would shame him for not taking the abuse by leaving, calling him weak.

[atskitty2]

I think it's the belief that men are stronger and shouldn't be hitting the weaker woman.
Then of course, if a man is stronger he isn't hurt by a measly woman. He could stop her easily if he wants to.

They are both unacceptable.

I do admit tho, that I've had to check myself with this in the past. It's one of the harder things to break - that mentality that I was brought up to believe about women's inferiority to men.

[Stillness]

I don't think it is acceptable anymore. Even in the early 90's (when this incident occurred), it was clear to me that she wasn't an innocent victim. What I suspect happened is that the situation got out of control and she got scared and wanted to make it clear that a violent relationship wasn't tolerable, regardless of where the fault was. I think she also felt that his response was extreme.

That latter portion is where things get kind of fuzzy. If someone is trying to do serious physical damage to you, I think everyone is cool with self-defense, regardless of the sex. But in the case in question, he wasn't defending himself. There was no danger to him. He got physical with a smaller, weaker person that he's supposed to protect with his life. So there's really not equality. She is inferior.

Whatever the case, I didn't see it as an abusive type of situation then and I don't now. It was just a domestic squabble.

[jns]

I don't think it is acceptable anymore. Even in the early 90's (when this incident occurred), it was clear to me that she wasn't an innocent victim. What I suspect happened is that the situation got out of control and she got scared and wanted to make it clear that a violent relationship wasn't tolerable, regardless of where the fault was. I think she also felt that his response was extreme.

That latter portion is where things get kind of fuzzy. If someone is trying to do serious physical damage to you, I think everyone is cool with self-defense, regardless of the sex. But in the case in question, he wasn't defending himself. There was no danger to him. He got physical with a smaller, weaker person that he's supposed to protect with his life. So there's really not equality. She is inferior.

Whatever the case, I didn't see it as an abusive type of situation then and I don't now. It was just a domestic squabble.

Start something and then cry foul if you don't like the outcome that you cannot control, smh. If he only pushed her, his response was far from extreme. He was definitely holding back. I think that many women don't really get how violent a confrontation between guys can become. After beating the crap out of each other, some guys will hug each other and remain friends.

As far as taking the damage if it doesn't leave marks, isn't that where Goliath became overconfident in his battle with David. He thought David couldn't do damage so he let his guard down. After condescendingly believing a woman cannot do damage, what are you going to do when she picks up a butcher knife and sticks it deep into you?

I can say one thing. That confrontation was probably necessary so that both knew what was and wasn't expected. It probably led to a healthier relationship.

[amy40]

occasionally, I will try to tickle husband which he does not like
he will warn me and say watch it, you'll get hurt to get me to stop because he has grabbed my wrists to stop me
and I've said that hurts (but I started the tickling) so he warns me

[amy40]

it's surprising how many fights/yelling I've heard on our street (some of it's parents yelling at teens)
and police have come twice for a couple fighting

[Stillness]

C'mon, jns. You've been married long enough to have conflicts - in an intercultural relationship, no less. Whose fault are they? Maybe one person's sometimes, but often both share blame. Do they amount to abuse? Conflict is not the same as abuse and it's not really something easily assessed by someone outside. Even the people involved struggle to figure things out.

That's why I stay out of other people's business. Even in my teens that was my policy with them. It's probably why we're so close now. If there had been an abusive situation, I would have gotten involved.

Abuse is more of a pattern of extreme mistreatment. Do people even still have the concept that women can't be abusers? Maybe they think of them more as emotional offenders, but they can be responsible for physical abuse too. I think people get that now, but maybe I'm wrong.

[Stillness]

occasionally, I will try to tickle husband which he does not like
he will warn me and say watch it, you'll get hurt to get me to stop because he has grabbed my wrists to stop me
and I've said that hurts (but I started the tickling) so he warns me

That's the down side of physical play - someone gets hurt. Always a bummer.

I had to keep warning my wife about jumping out and scaring me. It's only fun for one side and I felt like I might hurt her one day if she jumped out too close and startled me. We still hide, but no jumping out. I stopped too...equality and all.

[atskitty2]

I think laying hands on someone in anger this way, constitutes abuse. Just as verbal or mental or emotional. It may be a single incident or ongoing. I still think it's abusive tho, and doesn't matter whether male or female.

[amy40]

David and Goliath

our kid's bible says Goliath laughed as David was just a boy

I say....
Goliath could have saved his life had he thrown down his sword and said "I'm not fighting a boy"