[lost_in_TO]

Thank god I am finally going to the therapist today. I had a break down last night. I was so shot tempered with my daughter last night that it scared the out of me.

After yesterday's hug, she threw a curve ball at me by saying she was going to her Mom's for the weekend. We take one step closer and she runs for the hills. He Mom loves me so maybe this is the best thing. Maybe her Mom will help her clear her mind. Either that, or her Mom will encourage her to do what she wants which is what her Mom always does. He Mom's relationship with her Step Dad is the one my wife is trying so hard to avoid. I am nothing like him so I am not sure why she is making the comparison.

At any rate, only 4 hours to go. Not that I think the therapist is going to give me the answers I need but at least hopefully I will be offered some skills to help me cope since I am not doing a great job right now.

[LanaBear]

Thanks for the update. I'm sure it is especially difficult with the Christmas just around the corner. Keep your chin up as much as you can.

[lost_in_TO]

Sad to say it is over. I went to the therapist and it did not go well.

After we talked for a while, she had me admit to myself that I think my wife has given up already. She agreed and said "I'm not the best judge of things like these but Robin said it was okay to share her feelings with you." I asked what her feeling were and she launched into a couple stories about women who had rough childhoods that had a partner help them through a lot of things. Eventually, the women grew up and changed and there was nothing their partner could do to keep them. It was no fault of the partner.

I started getting angry and she asked if I was angry at her. I said ya. She says "is it because you think Robin and I plotted to bring you here so I could tell you it's over because she can't"

I said yes that is how it seemed. She says "yah and smiles".

WTF! What kind of therapy is that?? I started getting even more angry and I told her my mind twists and turns things that may not actually be there. I told her I feel like she is breaking up with me for Robin. I asked her to please tell me if I am going crazy or not. She smiled.

I was a wreck after and called my wife. I asked her to come home. She was over an hour a way and I managed to calm down by the time she got home. She said she did not tell the therapist to say these things. She said they talked about her feelings and she gave her permission to share them with me but she did not tell the therapist to end out marriage for her.

We talked for a couple hours and I told her I was sorry for freaking out and that all I needed to know was that there was a shread of hope this could be fixed. She said part of her knows it is done and part of her is scared to leave. I asked if there was any part that thought it could be saved. She said no.

We are basically going to continue living together until the holidays are over. Hopefully we can give Alina some sort of XMas.

After that, I don't know what is going to happen.

[lost_in_TO]

The final follow up.

After she told me there was no hope Friday night and went away for the weekend, she came home Sunday and asked if I wanted her to leave. She said she had somewhere she could go. A friend's boss has an apartment beside hers. The boss goes away for the winter to Florida and said my wife can stay in his place as long as she needs.

Since she said there was no hope, I said yes. If we weren't able to fix it, I need to move on and having her in the same house, sleeping in the same bed is not going to be good for me. As she was packing her stuff up, I asked what I am supposed to tell Alina in the morning when she asks where Mommy is? I said do I tell her mommy doesn't live here anymore?

She said "of course not. This is a temporary thing and maybe after a couple weeks I will realize that this is what I want". Talk about head games.

If there is no hope, there is no hope isn't there? I told her she can't do that to me. It isn't fair she take away any chance from me only to say there is a chance 2 days later. I said if you say these things, you better mean it.

I've had my daughter alone since Sunday. It has actually been better than expected. I know my wife still cares for us. She spent the rest of the day cooking for me to make it easier. All I have had to do is take something out of the fridge and warm it up. So much easier than cooking something from scratch with a 3 year old tugging on my leg asking me to play and telling me she's hungry.

I really don't know where my head is at though. I am trying to move on but am scared that if I give up, she isn't going to fight for me. If I give up, my marriage is over. I know I can't force her to stay and that isn't what I want but if she is still confused, isn't this the time to fight?

All of her family has called me and said they think she is making the biggest mistake ever. They say I am welcome anytime and they still want me there for Xmas. It's going to be hard but I think I need to be there for my daughter so I think I will go. I just hope it isn't too weird for everyone.

Everybody I talk to tell me I'm being a chump and that she is already banging someone. I honestly believe her when she says she would never do that to me but after hearing it from everyone I talk to (including some of her friends and family) how can I not have that thought in my head?

I just can't believe this is happening. It is still too hard to believe. Never in a million years did I see this coming.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

Her real dad left her when she was about 3. She didn't have any contact with him until she was about 16.

I asked what I am supposed to tell Alina in the morning when she asks where Mommy is? I said do I tell her mommy doesn't live here anymore?

She said "of course not. This is a temporary thing

She needs help, in my opinion.

She's not just left you, but her 3 year old daughter, just like her father left her. Usually, a "parent" will NOT repeat the same mistake that was thrown onto them, that they didn't like.

She's seeking complete freedom... whether she picks her daughter up later or not and takes her away from you to live with her, at this point she has left you AND, her daughter.

She really needs more than a Marriage councellor in my opinion.

CW

[WildChild]

Wow, sounds like the therapist really stepped over the line. Seeing a therapist is a good idea but I'd find another one. It's really unfortunate that you had to deal with that on top of everything else.

it sounds like your wife seems to expect things to just happen without really facing up to what she is doing. It sounds like she wants the door open to all options. Perhaps she is hoping you'll just say, it's over, so she won't feel like the bad guy?

Knowing that you can't change her and that she may vacillate for some time, what do you want?

[lost_in_TO]

It seems that way. Like she is doing things to push me away. I will really not be surprised if she cheats on me if I don't give up. That will be her way to make sure I tell her to go for good. I sure hope it doesn't happen though.

She is still seeing the therapist. SHe really likes her. I can't help but wonder what kind of advice she is getting though based on my encounter with her. That is scary as !

She is not herself lately so I can't really understand most of her actions. She honestly think she hasn't left our daughter. She sees this as a better life for her since she feels we will eventually grow to hate each other.

Since I can not change her mind, I am living my life and trying to move on. It's hard as .

[WildChild]

In theory a therapist has been trained to be somewhat objective, to assist you working out what is going on and how you can best handle ii. In reality, they are people and often damaged people who got into it to deal with their own issues. Maybe a therapist helped them and they want to do the same, maybe they like playing with people's heads ( and they really can), they all have their own experiences, preconceived ideas and points of view which in some way color their interaction with clients.

I've been fortunate to have a couple of good therapists, have also seen some mediocore. The last one was great, hit the nail on the head, "if you want to move forward and get help with some coping skills and developing a plan, I can help. If you want to wallow in your stuff, I'll recommend someone else"

Sounds your wife and this therapist have connected but that doesn't mean it will be helpful. You can't choose who she sees, nor can she choose who you see. If you are doing couples counseling, you see the same therapist, usually together. Otherwise you see different therapists. All the therapist has to work with is education, experience (professional and personal) and what you tell them. Who knows what your wife has or will share? I think (this based on my expereinces, preconceived ideas and what you've told us) that CW may have hit the nail on the head. She is going into a knee jerk pattern from her childhood. You may not be able to stop that but consider this - you may be able create a loving environment where your daughter doesn't continue the pattern. This rather reminds me of the movie Chocolat, the mother goes with the wind because her mother did and her daughter literally breaks the pattern by dropping and breaking the urn of soil.

Interview a few other counselors, see if you can find one you are comfortable with who will help you with skills to manage this life change well. You are starting not only a time of change but there will be grieving, maybe anger, frustration, self doubt, prehaps blaming, acceptance. Having someone who isn't in it can really help. We are here for you as long as you need but sitting one on one and talking can do a world of good. Also a good counselor will be familiar with local laws on divorce, custody and other matters you will need to consider.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

She honestly think she hasn't left our daughter.

But she has, just like her Daddy did to her... I think she's running away from her childhood personally, it's the same year, (3)...I think this is what she is not coping with her Daddy leaving her at 3, and therefore, she leaves her daughter at 3, I'm not convinced this has everything to do with "marriage" but rather, her own childhood and how she didn't cope and how she's not coping now... She can't relate to the pain she suffered, then.. She's doing the same thing to her daughter. She's hidden it in the back of her mind and I would be sending her Therapist a letter, asking her to consider talking to her about this issue.

I feel in my "opinion" this is the main issue and she's supressed it, as you state " she honestly doesn't think she has left her daughter".....

CW

[lost_in_TO]

She will never abandon Alina. If things don't work out, we will do shared custody. That why she thinks she hasn't left her.

She is well aware of her daddy issues and she tells me that she is talking to the therapist about it. I will be bringing it up when we go to see the couples therapist I am picking. I have an appointment booked for Jan 8th. It's the earliest we could get in due to the holidays etc. I sure hope there is something left to save by then.