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Fool me twice, shame on me

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  • Fool me twice, shame on me

    Hi all. I've been back on the site for a little while now checking things out, and trying to figure out where to start with everything I'm going through. Mostly, I've been just driving myself crazy and need an outlet to vent.
    I started a thread here in 2011 about my husband having emotional affairs through Skype, on his phone, and through texts (don't know how to add the link), but we had worked through our problems...or I thought we had.
    Since then a lot has changed. We've moved a couple of times, I took some college classes, and I started working again. Then, I got pregnant with our third child, and I had so many problems with nausea that I quit. I'm at 38 1/2 weeks and just stopped getting sick a little over a month ago.
    I was at 7 months pregnant when my husband came home from a birthday night out at the bar. He was completely trashed and muttering some gibberish about him and his boss talking about why I didn't like her. He stumbled in and passed out on the couch, so I checked his phone and found a bunch of sexual texts he had sent to his boss while they were at the bar together. He talked about rubbing on her thighs, how sexy she was, wanting to eat her out, and asked about having sex. She didn't respond on the texts except one early on telling him to calm down and behave, but since they were out at the bar at the time, I don't know how comforting that really is. There were other coworkers there, too, but still very upsetting.
    I couldn't wake him up, and even caught myself with my hand in the air ready to dish out a beat down while he was passed out. Instead, I walked out and called a friend. I set up a vacation to go see her with my two boys, and didn't talk to him about anything for a couple days, other than to tell him I was upset, but not ready to discuss it. Also, I made myself a counseling appointment the next morning so I could start trying to think out what I wanted to do.
    When I told him about what I saw, he said he didn't remember anything including the texts which had been deleted. So, I told him that wasn't good enough for me. I told him I didn't believe him and didn't think there was anything I could do to move forward with him. I wasn't going to play detective like I did last time and try to track down all his infidelities. I needed to know he was being honest with me because he could be, not because he had been caught and had to be.
    He initiated and set up marriage counseling, which I went without really thinking it would help, but I didn't tell him that. I still don't know if I think it's really helping, or helping me I should say. Our counselor says we need to put ourselves in a state of mind where leaving isn't an option, which...I understand, but I'm not there yet. I haven't decided that I can recover in our marriage.
    After our first appointment we were supposed to each come up with some issues we wanted to talk about at our next session (3 wks later). Apparently he took that to mean I was supposed to wait 3 weeks for him to be honest with me, and I had to explain why that wasn't fair to me and that the counseling was to help us communicate with each other in areas we were having trouble, not to limit our communication only to monthly sessions.
    I told him about my vacation plans about a week before we were leaving. We left on June 10th and came back the 13th, so he wouldn't miss Father's Day with our kids. I have an open invitation to stay with my friend if I need to, but didn't like the idea of being somewhere I wasn't familiar with when I'm fixing to have a baby. Anyway, I told him it was to give me a chance to do some thinking about what I wanted and have some space.
    He told me a day or so later that he had sexted with a nurse he works with one time about a year ago. He said he felt guilty about it and had to confront her at work and ask her to stop sending photos. Then he added that he did that before he found out how big of a ********** she was and that it made him feel dirty. I'm not sure if that part was supposed to make me feel better, but it didn't. She's not married and she's not the person I need to trust for my marriage to work. The name calling just made it seem like he was blaming her and not taking responsibility, like this was something that was done to him.
    I'm not done with the whole story, but I gotta take a break. There's a lot to get out here

  • Keep going hon, we're listening.
    [FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR="#800080"][B][SIZE=4]Woman trapped inside a woman's body![/SIZE][/COLOR][/B][/FONT]

    Comment


    • Yes, whenever you're ready, we'll be here.

      Comment


      • We are all here for you at least electronically. Sending virtual hugs.
        Freedom is just another word for nothing left to lose - Kris Kristofferson and Fred Foster (sung by Janis Joplin)

        Comment


        • A little one on the way, so close Crystal. We'll be here for both, this and the birth of your beautiful new child xx
          PUT A LITTLE 'LIKE' IN MY SOUL!

          Comment


          • You have no shame to bear. You opened your heart, truly forgave your husband's indiscretions and have just recently learned he didn't honor his promise to you. You've confronted him and you are here seeking support. I understand the title of your thread, but this is his shame, not yours. You've said there's more, so for now I'll patiently wait to hear the full story before jumping in and commenting further.

            Best Wishes
            Euphoric

            Comment


            • Thanks for the support y'all. I've been feeling pretty broken & didn't realize it was going to take so much out of me to get the whole story out.

              So, he told me about sexting with his coworker. In 2011 I found out he was having phone sex with a friend he grew up with, and he said she had contacted him 7 or 8 months ago, wanting to start up again and he had told her no. He says he hasn't heard from her since then.

              I didn't ask for many details because, going from memory of the last time, they don't put me at ease or really settle anything for me. They just lead me to feeling like I have more questions, but I did ask what he was looking for, how everything started, and mainly just why. He says he wants us to be together, that he's not wanting or looking for anything else, and that he thought his porn use might be the problem. This was before my get away trip, so I kinda took that with me and tried to digest everything while I was away. It wasn't nearly a long enough break to do that because I still don't feel like I have the answers I need or know what I should do.

              I got back home, and we talked, but I couldn't dive in too deep because he was pretty tipsy when we got home. But his drinking was the main topic. I had already told him before I left that it was going to be a long while before I trusted him to go out to the bar, but we hadn't talked about his drinking in general. This wasn't an issue back in 2011. He didn't drink at all then. For the past year it had been a regular thing for him to drink all weekend and any days off, to the point where he would just pass out in the living room.

              That night he had agreed to stop drinking, and it was discouraging to have him bring it up the next morning, wanting to know if he could still have a few drinks to relax when we were at home or out with friends. I told him I honestly didn't have the answers for what was going to work, and that my problem with him drinking was that was his priority and what he was investing in, not spending time with me or the kids. When he had a day off, the first thing on his mind was getting beer. It wasn't, we can go to the movies or take the boys to the park. He was just ****ing away his family and the time he had to teach our sons how a father acts. We talked about all of that, but ultimately I let him make his own choice on if he could have a few drinks.

              That night he told me he had used some of our condoms while I was gone. He had said he put them on my "toy" and used it on himself because he wanted to know what it felt like. Now...my issue here isn't about him liking that because he has his own toys. That wasn't a secret. I've used them on him. I wasn't happy about him using mine for cleanliness reasons, but still not my real concern. He said he had used 3, but I counted the box before I left and only 1 was missing. It would've been 3 to make it a whole box.

              I checked our phone record the next day, and he had called the coworker he sexted with while I was out of town. It was a 4 minute conversation, and he said she had asked him about going out to the bar while they were at work and he had called her to tell her no. Not a long enough conversation for phone sex, but plenty of time to set something up.

              He's made it impossible for me to trust anything he tells me. I feel completely disrespected; mind, body, and soul. As much as I love him and want to believe him, I don't know if I have it in me to work through this. There's a pattern to how he acts and it seems to follow the thought that what I don't know, won't hurt me. He does whatever not thinking about how it might make me feel or how I'll interpret what I do find.

              I've still been doing weekly counseling sessions on my own, and she's encouraged me to stay and work on getting educated and starting a career so I can support myself and the kids, while hoping that we can rebuild our relationship in the mean time.

              My husband hasn't gone out without me. He hasn't been drinking like he was, and hasn't been stumbling around drunk at all. He's been planning and taking us on family outings every weekend and starts us watching movies together or playing board games for family nights at home. I can tell he's really trying and wanting to make things better. I think he's really scared of losing his family and wants to do whatever it takes.

              I told him I wasn't trying to make him feel like the changes he was making weren't important, because they are. We're a better family because of what he's doing, but as far as our relationship goes, I'm still hurting all the time. I push it back and hide it so I can still have a good time and have fun, but when I let myself just feel, I can tell it's been with me constantly, just this continuous weight in my heart. I'm still grieving for what I thought we had. He says he understands it's going to take time and doesn't expect me to trust him anytime soon.

              I want there to be some hope that we can have a better, stronger marriage, but I'm stuck in a limbo of not being able to give up on our marriage and not having faith that we can work through this. What makes it worse is I'm going to have a baby girl any day now, and I know I'm going to need to feel like I have his support and commitment. I was completely confident in our relationship when I had our first two. I don't have that this time. I feel like I haven't been able to enjoy this pregnancy. I've been throwing up sick for the majority of it and dealing with a broken heart for the last of it. I'm excited to meet her, and I know I'll love her to pieces. I just wish things were better.

              Comment


              • Hey Crystal, I'll have more to say later but you seem to have an unusually firm grasp of the facts here and how they affect you, so I think you have an advantage going in. You're an intelligent woman, and you've done well assessing all this.
                [FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR="#800080"][B][SIZE=4]Woman trapped inside a woman's body![/SIZE][/COLOR][/B][/FONT]

                Comment


                • Okay, a question or two. We all have intuition, and it usually tells us the truth, even if it's sometimes not especially specific. So, what does your 'gut' say as to the basic question of whether he's trustworthy or not? Don't overanalyze it, just try to answer the question itself with a yes or no. Is he trustworthy?

                  Other question I have is more broad. What are the fundamentals of happiness for you? I don't mean like 10 summer houses all over the world, etc., I mean what core things do you have to have to feel happy and fulfilled in life? Things that the lack of would make you unhappy.
                  [FONT=Trebuchet MS][COLOR="#800080"][B][SIZE=4]Woman trapped inside a woman's body![/SIZE][/COLOR][/B][/FONT]

                  Comment


                  • You know change is difficult. I tend to think if someone needs to drink excessively whenever they aren't working there are enormous stresses in their life. Does your husband enjoy his profession or does he just work.

                    Not playing the Devil's advocate but some men find it hard to be a family man, bring the money home regardless whether she works or not, play Dad, go to work and continue. He seems to have lost his passion for life for some reason and I suspect the alcohol is a let out for him, he didn't want to go out if he couldn't drink as he had to drive.

                    I think time is something you two are going to need regardless love.

                    In the meantime, your little girl will come into this world filled with love.

                    It's very difficult to re-build trust but it's obvious that he is taking some steps and listening to you.
                    PUT A LITTLE 'LIKE' IN MY SOUL!

                    Comment


                    • I've refrain from commenting on this because my thoughts may be skewed, however, there are a few comments that make me question his lifestyle.

                      He didn't drink at all then. For the past year it had been a regular thing for him to drink all weekend and any days off, to the point where he would just pass out in the living room.
                      That night he told me he had used some of our condoms while I was gone. He had said he put them on my "toy" and used it on himself because he wanted to know what it felt like. Now...my issue here isn't about him liking that because he has his own toys. That wasn't a secret. I've used them on him.
                      There's a pattern to how he acts and it seems to follow the thought that what I don't know, won't hurt me.
                      He says he wants us to be together, that he's not wanting or looking for anything else, and that he thought his porn use might be the problem.
                      Is it possible, by viewing porn, he's wrestling with sexual fantasies or identity? CW makes an excellent point about excessive alcohol use, especially when he never drank before. Admitting that he used condoms and your toys brings up a point of curiosity. He has his own toys and that's never been an issue, in fact, you have used them on him. Then why explore with yours? I think there's a reason. Maybe he does have the attitude what you don't know won't hurt but that could be because he embarrassed to admit he's fantasizing about alternative relations and fighting an alternative urge?

                      He is putting forth an effort by initiating marriage counseling and he's making an effort to spend quality time with the family. I don't think all is lost here, watching porn may have sparked an interest he didn't know existed and as a result he acted out to suppress those emotions.

                      Again, my thoughts may be skewed a bit, I'm just thinking out of the box. His behavior seems to have taken a radical turn. He is trying and wants to make things better. I think you'll have his support with the sweet baby girl that going to make a grand entrance any day now. Jen's correct, you have a firm grasp on reality. I hope counseling opens the lines of communication and eventually your marriage will be stronger.

                      Comment


                      • I also waited to respond until I had the time to digest your story and to read your prior thread from 2011. I will admit to only reading through 9 pages (I think it's 17), but I feel like I have enough information to make an informed response.

                        Your husband appears to have a very strong addictive personality. You met him in a recovery program. He had been to jail for some reason related to his addiction. He became (or was always) addicted to video games, which occupied his time instead of the marriage. It's difficult to know when it started, but he then became addicted to sexting (through texts and Skype). You did not mention in 2011 that he was drinking again, but that addiction started again, just about the time you became pregnant. Then the sexting began again (although it appears to me that it escalated a bit since his boss was physically present at the bar but it appears that nothing happened). Now, porn is involved, another very addictive behavior. I have summarized his behaviors in this manner because I believe that this is an addiction problem more than a marital one. For whatever reasons, and I think he desperately needs to understand his demons and triggers, he is self soothing in an intentionally very destructive way.

                        I do not think that the root of his behavior is you or the relationship. When he is able to exercise control over his addictions, he tries very hard to be a good husband. He appears to be very remorseful over his indiscretions. He makes great efforts to change. He did so in 2011 only to backslide. My guess is that you were too sick and focused on this pregnancy to be more proactive when he resumed drinking. Addicts are not trustworthy and cannot be trusted until they have control over their addiction. Based on your posts, he does not have control over his demons.

                        I am not a psychologist and my understanding of addictions are from my own set of behaviors and from the behaviors of some people I am close with. However, it all fits from your two threads (unless there was something I missed in pages 10-17). You need to completely focus on the new baby and your other two children. The direction of your marriage is an issue best addressed when the baby is old enough for you to start working again and can be independent. The more urgent need is for your husband to get back into recovery for his addictions. That is where I suggest he put his efforts to save the marriage.
                        "The only consistent feature of all of your dissatisfying relationships is you." Despair.com "Dysfunction"

                        Comment


                        • For Crystalblue's 2011 thread go to: https://www.womens-health.com/boards...husband-s.html
                          I have but one lamp by which my feet are guided, and that is the lamp of experience.
                          ...
                          Shall we gather strength by irresolution and inaction? Shall we acquire the means of effectual resistance by lying supinely on our backs and hugging the delusive phantom of hope, until our enemies shall have bound us hand and foot?

                          From a speech by Patrick Henry on March 23, 1775 at St. John's Church, Richmond, Virginia

                          Comment


                          • Thanks jns,I had to find it the hard way by searching key words.

                            By the way, I read more of the thread. CW nailed his addictive personality on page 16!
                            "The only consistent feature of all of your dissatisfying relationships is you." Despair.com "Dysfunction"

                            Comment


                            • I have my settings at 40 posts per page (which I might suggest to many) so the post you are talking about is on page 4 toward the end. It is post #155.
                              I have but one lamp by which my feet are guided, and that is the lamp of experience.
                              ...
                              Shall we gather strength by irresolution and inaction? Shall we acquire the means of effectual resistance by lying supinely on our backs and hugging the delusive phantom of hope, until our enemies shall have bound us hand and foot?

                              From a speech by Patrick Henry on March 23, 1775 at St. John's Church, Richmond, Virginia

                              Comment

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