[Hugo-B]

I'm guessing you don't go out much and interact with many other available women? - no offense - but it's not just the temptation of sex but the attention and interest other women would have shown you would likely have drawn a harsh comparison and made you seriously evaluate your situation a while back.

I'm resentful that I invested far too much financially, emotionally and chronologically in relationships with women who had too many issues they needed to work though before they even stood a chance of being in a healthy relationship. I'm annoyed with myself for putting up with it for so long and not pulling the plug when I should have and just starting again, I'm also resentful that it's made me less tolerant and that I'll never get any of the time back that I wasted piously trying to hold onto something which was doomed from the beginning. Women like that prey on men who will put up with it - they have to - it's the only means they have of avoiding being single. It's amazing when you look back how you wonder where your self respect went and how everything that just seemed normal was unacceptable - I can even remember being woken up in the night by my ex so she could start a fight with me - fully aware I wouldn't be able to get back to sleep and had to get up for work in the morning.

I think this needs putting to rest Jon. I've got all the time in the world for you on here my friend, but we can't solve this for you, none of us can. SHE needs to hear this, and she needs to know you mean business, empty threats wont cut it. Partner's who hear empty threats frequently just lose (even more) respect for the person making them. If I were you (and I'm no expert on relationships but you'll learn plenty from my mistakes) I would sit down and write her a detailed letter. You need to explain that if she's not willing to even try and address her issues you two have no future together, you believe you deserve better than to be treated like a live in house keeper and it's not going to carry on.

I don't want to sound negative but I personally can't see her making any significant changes after all these years, I'm actually worried that fear of you abandoning her - real fear, if the threat is sincere enough - may be a real motivator which could bring around an improvement - but it would be for the wrong reasons, and that itself isn't going to effect the required change.

I would analyze the situation financially too, in terms of divorce etc. If she knows she has the upper hand in terms of (I think you call it alimony) then she's less likely to take any threats you make re leaving her seriously. The bottom line is: if she knows you can't afford to leave her, then in the most brutally objective terms, she has the upper hand in this and most probably knows it.

Your finances are your business s think long and hard about this in terms of worst case scenario in case things turn nasty as far as a separation goes. I don't of any amicable divorce stories in any divorce in which there were any assets to fight over. The Law is heavily in favor of the woman as you know.

Anyway, it hopefully wont get to any of that, just be aware though that if she does call your bluff and challenges you to leave she may well have already thought about all this long and hard.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

I'm not sure I fully know what you are asking. I don't want to assume.

Just what you replied, I wanted to ascertain as to whether she is putting any effort, ie) enjoying it, has passion or not, I already gathered you would be doing everything you could.

I think you have to ask yourself one question.. Why is she even "trying" without trying really, women know if they give just enough, he'll usually stay, so why is she staying.. She obviously, is avoiding as everyone is saying, you and anything to do with marriage, apart from just making some "small" effort.

[JonDoe]

Just what you replied, I wanted to ascertain as to whether she is putting any effort, ie) enjoying it, has passion or not, I already gathered you would be doing everything you could.

I think you have to ask yourself one question. Why is she even "trying" without trying really, women know if they give just enough, he'll usually stay, so why is she staying.. She obviously, is avoiding as everyone is saying, you and anything to do with marriage, apart from just making some "small" effort.

She definitely enjoys sex, but she is just not putting in much effort or initiating. She has all the tell-tale signs of orgasms, some of which you just can't fake.

She has passion for several things in life, but it is tough to gauge passion from your partner when she just lays there and lets you do all of the work and doesn't initiate. I'd love for her to at least occasionally initiate, and perhaps even appear to really want it and have to have it right now!

She has never once in 23 years opened her eyes or made eye contact during sex. Perhaps she is always fantasizing about someone else, and I am merely providing the equipment. I doubt it, but then again I have no way of knowing. I've thought of telling her to call out my name as she is having an orgasm, but avoided the expected awkward confrontation. The last girl I dated before my wife made eye contact and called out my name when she was having orgasms, which was so hot!

My wife has never been much on kissing besides a peck on the cheek before going to bed without me (for many years) or before me (now that we are sleeping together again). I have no idea why she isn't much on kissing; I've asked, but you already know from my posts what happens when I try to talk about these things. She'll hold my hand when we are walking together or occasionally when sitting in church. She'll occasionally initiate a hug without prompting, but that is a rare occurrence.

Why is she staying? She says she loves me and needs me. When I've asked "why do you need me?" she gives a long list, which doesn't include any form of intimacy. I don't think intimacy is important to her, which is something that is stereotypically associated with men. Are other women like this where they could take or leave most forms of intimacy?

[DreamP346]

Is it possible she is getting her intimacy else where? Remember, it doesn't have to be another man or sex to get intimacy. With the internet and texting, people have relationships with people they don't physicially meet. Could she be getting her emotional needs met by somebody else. Just a thought.

[JonDoe]

Is it possible she is getting her intimacy else where? Remember, it doesn't have to be another man or sex to get intimacy. With the internet and texting, people have relationships with people they don't physicially meet. Could she be getting her emotional needs met by somebody else. Just a thought.

It is certainly possible, but not likely. I've checked cell phone logs, browser history and such to rule it out, plus she was like this before cell phones, the Internet and Facebook. Her routine and behavior have not changed.

She could be having an affair, hooking up with someone during her lunch break at work and I'd never know. She comes straight home after work or comes home shortly after work with groceries, and I work from home. She goes out a few times a month with her girlfriends that I know.

[Hugo-B]

I hope she's not having an affair. But what I do believe is that women are typically better at lying to men than vice versa. If she was having an affair I'd expect her to be coming up with more creative excuses for staying out more than twice a month.

Is there anything she does or anywhere she goes which could be seemingly innocent which you have never thought of seeking proof of, the gym maybe? Have you seen her wage slips from work, does she work all the hours she says she does? Does she always say she sees her friends during the day on the weekends?

Regardless these would be good things to rule out anyway, like I said I hope she's not having an affair, and whilst I'm not a jealous guy I would be ready to explore this possibility around now.

[JonDoe]

Is there anything she does or anywhere she goes which could be seemingly innocent which you have never thought of seeking proof of, the gym maybe? Have you seen her wage slips from work, does she work all the hours she says she does? Does she always say she sees her friends during the day on the weekends?

No, there aren't too many places she goes without me or one of the kids. Occasionally out for a drink with one or more girlfriends, or to get her hair or nails done, but nothing frequent or routine.

Yes, I have seen paystubs and she is working the hours that she says she does.

When she goes out, it is generally on Friday night or during the day on weekends.

[Hugo-B]

Well that's good then, whilst anything is possible it appears she's not being unfaithful.

As I mentioned prior Jon I would write her a letter now stating all of your concerns, whilst SP2346's idea of scheduling an appointment to speak to her made sense, the fact that it has gotten to that highlights just how ridiculous things have got as far as her emotional absence goes.

[sunnyjessey]

you just need to be upfront, it will solve almost any problem.

[KMonte85]

you just need to be upfront, it will solve almost any problem.

that seems quite simplistic, sunny. Did you not read how often he has tried to be up front with her? She is avoiding and ignoring him. You can't force someone to hear you and make changes... you know, the whole "lead a horse to water" thing.