[effy2014]

All of the responders here have the same goal ... to give you are our perspectives (whether the same advice or different) with the hope that one or two will resonate with you and help you out. We respect one another as we should. Jenn's insight as to what is going on is always spot on. We sometimes differ on the fix or elimination of the problem but that is the best part of a forum such as this. Good luck to you.

[calibri~]

Oh incidentally I managed to bring up my concerns about our inability to communicate well together calmly....turns out he thinks our only communication problem is that I don't listen. Sooo....defense shields were up? Ugh maybe it IS that I don't listen and then twist things up? Bleh, and I was doing so well pointing out how childish some things he does are...

[jen1447]

I had a supervisor once who would go around rolling his eyes at people in disbelief and frequently shout "Listen!" at them. He was a man-child and frankly an idiot - incompetent, lazy, manipulative, etc. and everybody knew it. (He didn't know how to receive or send e-mail for example, but he'd accuse other people of dropping the ball with communication.)

Thinking everyone else has to do all the listening and being unable or unwilling to consider others' opinions are just more signs of immaturity.

[effy2014]

You can't communicate if the way in which the issues are approached lead to defensiveness. He is clearly not listening to you, but trying to place the blame on you. Try to make the conversation blame free. Rather than tell him how childish he is being (which, by the way, he is), tell him how his actions made you feel (when this happened it made me feel like this). If his response is that your feelings are wrong, then you have huge respect issues that are extremely difficult to overcome.

The worst part is that you are starting to believe that it is your fault. Ugh is right. Your feelings are valid because you feel them. A man that loves you should never want you to feel unappreciated and belittled. As I was channel surfing yesterday before the reruns of my favorite show came on the air, I listened to a preacher say the truest relationship words I have ever heard -- you can't complement your wife or husband too much. His lesson was the importance of verbalizing appreciation to keep couples together.

[calibri~]

It's got to the point that I don't know what to do with a compliment if I get one.....I tend to assume it's a joke at my expense, which is sad.

Regarding communication and appreciation, how do people show their partners appreciation for being sexually pleasured? Do you feel the need to do or say anything? A hug, a kiss, a comment....As I never get any noises of enjoyment, compliments or likewise, how do I know if he even enjoys it (other than asking for it again at some point?). Does anyone else's partner just rush to the bathroom to clean up then pretend nothing happened? I'm sure he thinks that just ejaculating as a result of something I do for him is thanks and appreciation enough. It just leaves me feeling really insecure ;( I have tried asking if he enjoyed it, and only get...what do you think, it was alright, you'll have to wonder, or shut up...
Am I expecting too much?

[effy2014]

The short answer is "Heck No". You should have the expectation of being loved and appreciated. The point of communication is to sensitize your parter to your needs. Not simply that you need to be appreciated, but that you need to be appreciated in a manner meaningful to YOU. For example, instead of asking him whether he liked sex, let him know that you need to be held, cuddled and kissed after sex. Men need the Dummies book for women -- be specific and see if he complies.

Me, I'm very feelings oriented and exceptionally grateful for the intimacy with my SO. We always cuddle after being sexual and I usually tell her it was the best ever -- because it usually feels that way. But it's not just complements in bed -- if he told you every day how beautiful you are and how lucky he is to be with you, it wouldn't matter so much.

IMHO, we humans need to feel appreciated and respected more than anything else. I remember the exact moment that I knew that my divorce was inevitable and it was over the feeling of being hopelessly and irreversibly unappreciated.

[rcoreyus]

Other people are making good comments, I just wanted to pick up on one thing you said:

You kissed someone else. Lets even say you had an affair (I know you didn't). I don't object if he wanted to leave a relationship for that reason - because I feel that anyone should feel free to leave any relationship if they want to, for any reason. **BUT** he absolutely should not hold it against you for any length of time. I think that complete forgiveness is required in a relationship, and anyone who can't do that should leave.

Basically he has a right to leave, but not to punish you and hold it against you for years.

Many years ago my wife did something that hurt me badly. She apologized. I accepted the apology and I have never mentioned it since. I don't hold it against her in any way - it is absolutely forgiven - as I hope she has really forgiven the things that I have done to her over these many years.

I have a female friend who told me that she cheated on her husband, and then confessed to him. He treats her very badly, and I think she may stay because of guilt - 30 YEARS later. No one should live their lives like that. If someone makes a mistake, they should apologize, make amends of that is possible - then get on with their lives.

Now you may say "wait a minute....I just kissed a guy, I didn't cheat!". YES, EXACTLY: what you did was just a tiny transgression, something that should be forgiven in an instant. I'm saying that people are owed forgiveness by their partners for even very serious transgressions, this was nothing.

T. One night I got drunk and kissed someone else and since then I'm not his princess anymore ( we are talking 8-9 years ago).

[calibri~]

Effy you are right, if I was ever told I was beautiful or special ( in a non retarded way) etc then I wouldn't get so paranoid.. The really sad thing is, he thinks a major issue is that HE feels unappreciated....so we are just circling each other rather than working things through

The thing is rcoreyus, although that was the most obvious, abrupt change in behaviour and attitudes, I feel that every pitiless thing I have done wrong is beung held against me. I am never forgiven. I am a very forgiving person, maybe too much, but I'd rather be that than hold people to ransom over something they have all but forgotten. In order to be treated like a princess again, I must fulfil a,b,c,d,etc and never slip up.or I'll have to start over... Is it any wonder I find it so difficult to try?

I've decided to talk to my counsellor lady about what I do or could bring to a relationship because SO thinks I give nothing at all, except maybe a nice pair of legs.
Right, so he finds me physically attractive, that's nice but it's not enough for me. I'd like to know if he even likes anything else about me anymore (now I'm not sick or dangerously depressed etc).I've asked but he tells me I'm being stupid. Sorry just throwing out some pent up thoughts

[effy2014]

The circling, as you call it, gives you an entrance to start to fix things. One way to kill a relationship ... and, in part, it killed my SO's marriage, was the "I won't do this for you because you never do that for me." Without the trust of reciprocation, neither will do anything nice. Of course, the reverse can be true -- if you do something nice for your parter, he or she may feel moved to reciprocate.

Since you both feel unappreciated, someone has to break the cycle. Me, I think it should be the man, because men should lead (as I duck for cover from the inevitable comments). However, in your situation, he won't. So my advice is to put the appreciation cards on the table. Ask him (other than in the bedroom), what would make him feel appreciated. Tell him that you do appreciate him and would love to do it for him ... the "catch" is that he must do something for you next. A loving ***-for-tat may get contagious.

The other thing I surmise from your post is that he feels taken advantage of in the relationship. He is keeping a scorecard of what you do and what he does. Sometimes pointing out what you do will sensitize him that you add value. I will personalize it again. My SO was a stay at home Mom; she cooked, cleaned, raised 3 kids, did all the household errands and made sure he had time for himself on the weekends. He felt she did nothing because she didn't earn a paycheck. Making someone feel worthless in a relationship leads to it's demise.

[rcoreyus]

I think keeping score in a relationship is really destructive.