[Joy]

Well it has finally happened my Bf has laid it all on the line the good the bad and the ugly.

This has been simmering for months. A lil background..... We have had a reltionship that has been full of obstacles. Some we have jumped and cleared and others have been skirted around and avoided like the plague. AS most of you know when you avoid some small things eventually they fester and grow into mountains.

Reading other posts in this forum being on the outside of your problem i can see the solution clearly. How ya got to the point of OMG how do i fix this or get the hel1 out.

My problem is my bf i thought was fun we use to listen to music, talk, hangout, laugh, and have fun! What he has shown me is his serious side and its boring and there is nothing to laugh at. We can't even talk with out it becoming tense. We've lived together for 4 yrs.

In the beginning he was afraid i would leave him for someone better he was going thru a depression and he had some insecurity issues. Now he is much better and his self confidence is back and its beautiful to see.

During the dark time i spent a lot of time trying to eliminate what was threanting to him . I realize i gave away parts of myself that i loved


So the sacrific i made is now what is ruining us and i have to get back to myself its what made me love me and i believe its what made him love me. hel1 i see myself as dull and boring now.

he told me tonight he wanted more.... and ya know what i told him he was right that if this wasn't enough if that spark of life is what he craved then he deserved it and should go after it.


I deserve that so if i want it for myself then i want him to have that as well. I think we have burned outselves out of one another. The fire that is suppose to burn in a relationship has been smoothered and put out.

he is truly an amazing person but so am i and if we can't be amazing together then we should be apart.

It will be sad to see this end he has been great to me and i love him very deeply but a good relationship is large enough for a couple to grow together and grow as indiviuals and this relationship is way to small for that. The biggest reason being trust he doesn't trust himself so he doesn't trust me. I can't handle the accusations its so draining and old after awhile. Its energy i shouldn't have to waste. So I've become stagnate and stale when i should be flying. I am not blaming him I want him to fly too I want all his dreams to come true too. I don't wanna give up on my goals or dreams even if they will only ever be dreams. I've let this rut of routine set in.

My biggest problem is getting back to me the new me that is emerging and what direction to take. I am the one that has to take the step to leave. The confusing part is he left the door open for us but it feels like a nail in the cofin at the same time.

at the moment confused~

[CHANDLERS WISH]

Hello you.

Venting is a good way to start.

Knowledge of who you were/are and are not at present is enlightening and good for you, as that's the biggest hurdle you know that. Most women will say "but I love him" and will do anything, practically for the rest of their lives and until, it's too late, they are older and things are harder to change.

You helped him through a tremendous amount... Depression is particularily hard to beat.. Your energy levels after 4 years must be particularily low, yet through that comes strength.

You are showing signs of strength in abundance.

That window is not shut, it is open and you are looking through it.

You know that YOU have to be YOU and the person besides YOU has to love you un-conditionally for all you are.. Not change you to suit them.

I suspect that what you have written, you understand the importance of this and you have been suffereing, supressing and walking on egg shells for too long, knowing he is watching over you and what you are doing, whom you are talking to, probably what you are writing even.

You are correct, people have to be amazing together, and fun and laughter is only part of a relationship... Serious side.... is good too but I am thinking you are meaning something else instead of the word serious like, a tad controlling maybe, not allowing you to be FREE to whom you are, YOU.

You are already getting back YOU, this didn't start to day it has been manifesting and you are at a cross roads, like I was 4 years, 7 years is a long time to "start all over again" but if that is what you choose to do, hold your head up and know, that the person that will not only make you laugh, but trust you, love you for you, and laugh at the silly things you do and love the way you think, is out there.. We both know that.

Non- trust can not be changed. It is in his blood, accusations on-going well that's negativity and you are way a positive person and as I said your energy is being drained.

Difference, he will walk the life and over and over again, lose the ones that he could have had like you that are amazing... And, end up with no one.

You on the other accord have given all you have, all you had and to someone whom doesn't appreciate all you are, doesn't trust you and that is the wrong person for YOU.

Look after YOU.. Joy...

regardless of what is to come.

CW

[Joy]

Oh he can be like dr Jeckel and Mr Hyde. I am presently at home working on launching an online business. He has only been working out side the house for a year. During his depression I did all i could to encourage him to help him get out of his rut. He is over his major depression but its still a negative daily battle for him.

For the last year he has fought me every step of the way on this venture. He has ridculed me, laughed at me, refused to help even though he would have been paid for his talent and time. Just two weeks ago his friends were sitting around i showed him an exciting new development with it and he laughed so hard and loud in front of them all. This venture could fail and flop but atleast i tried to create something.

So he has been making the money and i've been looking after the home and i've paid for every day don't you worry. When i have been on interviews he flip flops oh you don't have to work i don't care. Then when he is having a horrible day he brings up am i ever gonna get a job and contribute. When i did work he was resentful and never made it easy for me. He would accuse me of cheating and i never did but it just added stress to my day I was a store manager in a new company that needed a lot of work. After 3 years of battling his depression and 2 years of being a road warrior for this new company i started to have health issues and my Dr put me off work because of exhaustion. Which i don't blame him I am a grown woman I knew the signs that i was pushing myself too hard that i needed to slow down and recharge myself but i pushed my self just a lil more hoping to get a lil more out of the battery.

So he says to m e the other night He is tired of doing it alone building a life for us alone. He is crazy cause i support him every day so he can go to work. I make his lunch, have everything he needs organized and ready, His suppers made and hot when he gets home and i will go to work and help him. When i go back to work i already know it will take all of a couple months of me not giving him 100% and he will be out of work. Won't be able to cope he is hinting at this now. Part of him doesn't want me to work he has more control and the other half loves to rub it in. Which is funny cause he is so generous to everyone else and anybody would say that about him. He treats me like i don't deserve a f'n thing.

When he was at his lowest i helped him out emotionally, finacially, and mentally he didn't give a shiiit about anything but when i point that out he is so quickk to tell me i've never helped him out one bit which is ridiculous. He is like the alcoholic which once sober leaves the poor soul that stuck out the abuse but now he is sober and doesn't wanna face what he has done.

You are right i do love him there are days i can't wait to see him, hold his hand, kiss him, rub his back and make love to him and just feel the love between us. Other days I wonder what Hel1 have i stumbled into and woke up in?

I know on one level we can get thru this that there is more in store for us that could be absoulutly wonderful. We are both amazing people and we have worked hard and do deserve it. Honestly i don't know how to get there. Maybe we both can't share the spot light I wanna see him shine but deep down i don't think he wants to see me shine I think that would be way to threatening for him.

There is greatness inside all of us my greatness does not diminish your greatness its finding the love, support, courage and encouragement to reveal that greatness that helps all of us unearth our own. That internal power that no external material possession is greater than.

[WildChild]

Oh my! sounds like you are going through a younger version of what I've recently gotten out of! I supported mine thru depression when he was unemployed for over 3 of the first 4 years we were married and then saw him through cancer and several other health issues. I was accused of having affairs, after having been faithful through no sex for several years. After he went back to work I was a freeloader. When we got together it was wow he couldn't believe he had such a great woman in his life, but everything I did was belittled and I heard constant failure messages. When we broke up he wanted me to "repay" him for all that he had spent on me. Excuse me? He was unemployed for nearly half the marriage, we didn't live on a shoestring - it was a thread! Now he emails me links to mental hospitals and facilities - whatever!

I got into counseling and it really helped me move forward. It was also really reassuring to have a professional tell me I'm not a nut case, that I've handled incredible stress really well and that it's OK if I've felt a bit overwhelmed at times. He helped me put together a plan to get out (I have kids from a previous disaster) and to lay the groundwork to reclaim myself and my life. I was doing it on my own but having a pro gave me an added boost.

Think of him as a vampire, a psychic vampire. He feeds on you emotionally, drains your energy, creativity and power. As long as you stay grounded and connected you can handle this for quite a while but it takes it's toll and starts to wear you down. Eventually the repeated messages that you can't succeed, can't make it happen in business or anywhere else, start to sink in and take hold. My ex did get into the counselor with me -after all he expected the counselor to "fix" me. You know if you don't want a man while he still wants you, you must need fixing (lol). That was really interesting, after the counselor asked hubby to step into the waiting room, he asked me, "why are you staying with that man?!" "What are you thinking?" Then he got more professional again and told me I was married to a narcissist. They really can't love anyone but themselves. They are manipulative and controlling and good at tearing you down - sounds like you may have one of your own. Do some research about it and see how well it fits and see about counseling. Sometimes they can get quite dangerous because they can't Really see anyone else's viewpoint or understand that they are hurting you. At times they can put up the appearance of being loving but it's a tool to them, their concern isn't how you feel but how you make them feel. Of course they don't know that their feelings are negative or that they don't experience love the way others do. It's sad really, but they destroy the people around them.

We women are taught and conditioned to be givers, to the point of self destruction. You will have to take time to heal and learn not only to give but to recieve. Sometimes you have to just cut your losses, chalk it up to experience and move on. Get on line and type 'Mama Gena" into the search line. On her web site you can listen to a bunch of women talking about reclaiming themselves, finding their joy and power and having fun doing it - it's really uplifting. Get a hold of some of her books, regardless of what you decide to do about your relationship I think you'll find her philosophy is very healing after all you've been through and are going through. You're online name 'Joy' tells me you should be a Sister Goddess - probably already are without knowing it. Check out Mama Gena to find out what I'm talking about.

Think about it, aside from he is paying the bills what are you getting from this relationship? It sounds like it's all negative, if he throws you a bone once in a while that's not enough. Do you have kids? It doesn't sound like it. You can walk away.

Here's a little something I think I've finally learned, that every woman should have posted over her door or mirror to read and repeat everyday:
You Don't Get Any Extra Points For Suffering!

[Joy]

Thank you CW and Thank you Wild Child Thank you for the love and support you send. I looked up Mama Gena and I use to be that person of abundance with many people around me wanting to be around me cause of the good vibes that were always present.

WC he could very well be some of those things you explained. I do not harbour resentment of what all i have given of myself. I gave all the love and attention unconditionally. I am a strong woman and i know the power of my mind is my greatest asset.

I know he loves me but he is afraid of love because all he has ever loved has been lost and he does not love openly anymore. I have tried to help heal him and get him out of living in his past. He has pretty much mastered this. I know his triggers and what sends him into living in fear of the past repeating itself. That is his biggest fear. I know his wounds they were so visable when i met him. I have never tried to hurt him and make any of these wounds any deeper. I 'm not saying some of my actions haven't hurt him but i have never maliciously gone after the easy spots.

What i do need now is love not someone telling me i'm not as good as i think i am. I want a man that recongnizes the woman that i'm growing to be and would help me get there not step on her ever inch of the way. I have flaws I have lots of room for personal development I know i'm not as good as i think I am but one day i will be. One day I will be all I have dreamed and worked to be.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

But can you get him out of that Joy?

NO..

I am going to say, no.

Wildchild, you, myself and by the time you read this in what 2 weeks, there will be other's have had the "exact" treatment.

It is called "EMOTIONAL ABUSE".. "CONTROL"...

I know my ex-husband still loves me. He doesn't send me emails about mental hospitals, he sends funny jokes through, but if i reply I have to be very careful, as not to say something whereby it triggers and he turns around, to "correct me" I am wrong.

I started a business too Joy... He refused to be part of it as well.. We mortgaged his house and I sold mine, to do so.

I got the exact same... laughing, your never going to be anyone, when are your going to get a real job, your work is why this marriage failed, you gave it everything but nothing to me, think carefully before you leave, no one else will want you, and all the while i persued, and he never helped. And, yes, same thing, I took out a loan for the first 12 months together, as he injured his back, he didn't work for 16 months whilst I did, as well as the housework, cooking, feeding the animals, I did it all.

FEAR... Of the same things I think... Someone else will take her away... She will become successful and leave.. IN-SECURITY...

Could I change him?

NO

7 and a half years...

If I didn't leave when I did, my business would have fallen over and I would be bankrupt. Simple. The negativity and constant "emotional abuse" constantly told YOU CAN NOT, your not a good boss, get a real job... Did, start to get to me.

Now, my business is still here, it is starting to re-gain all that it lost as a result of MY NEGATVITY....

Don't get to the point where you give up your dream and spend all the money you have and end up back in a store...

Dont.

CW

[sTyLeRock]

well

One thing comes to mind when i see the origial post.

"Comfort VS Growth"

-Style

[Joy]

Thank you Style..... these are confusing times

[WildChild]

Joy and CW a lot of your stories are like reading parts of my life. As a child I was constantly told I could never do enough, share enough, or be good enough. I carried that into my adult life, like a torch. Growth is a process, sometimes it ebbs and flows, it reaches wonderful peaks but then because we are still weak in areas it subsides, hopefully at higher level than it started. Those of us who were raised with abuse have added layers to overcome. Our lack of adequate self preservation responses make us magnets for abusive personalities and we have to work extra hard at recognizing our value.

The cycle can be broken. I've had people tell me it can't but I know they are wrong. Joy, I do think Mama Gena has the right idea. I've been through some stuff you probably wouldn't believe and I always bounce back. My spirits rise, I can't stay down for long.

[Searching_82]

Wow...it seems like we are all going through the same thing in a way. Its nice to have others around to help us grow!