[Gearhead]

Hi all, I have a fairly serious question to ask and would like any and all help I can get on this. Please bear with me because this might be a little long winded and I really want to get solid advice on how to remedy the problem. I'm a married man, my wife & I are coming up on our 10th anniversary and we have been together for 13 years. I am 35, she is 34. Our sex life is pretty much non-existent when it comes from her end. I am always the one who initiates and if I don't bring it up, she would be completely content to go without it for months on end. The main reason for my asking this is because of a recent fight we had regarding sex. On the average, we would be lucky to have sex once every 10 days. When we first got married, we were a 2-5 times a week couple and had a very healthy sexual relationship. But now, not so. Anyway, I guess that the problem is that I have a real problem with not being able to make love to my wife on a regular basis. I would be real happy if it were 1-2 times a week, but it isn't anything close to that.

We get in an argument about sex at least every other month, her saying that I don't "get her in the mood" for it or about the way that I ask. The typical way that I do this is that I ask her "can I make love to you" or if I am feeling smart I will say on off-hand remark like "let's take our clothes of and roll around naked together". Almost every time I can count on one of these three answers: "_______(long, silent pause with glaring eyes)_____________"; "maybe later"; or my favorite "I have a headache". Those are the 3 main excuses that get me a verifiable and resounding NO SEX TONIGHT. And when she does agree to have sex, I get a reply of "only if you rub my back". When we were first married, I didn't mind the back rubs, they were fun and we made a game of them, but now it is a complete turn off for me and I absolutely hate giving her a back massage. But to satisfy my sexual desire, I end up giving the massage and move on to sex. There is no middle
ground.

Now the recent fight we had was that I said "hey honey, let's have sex tonight" and she replied in one of the nastiest voices I have ever heard her use "What did you say?" and I said "forget it". The next night I asked "let me make love to you" and her response was just as venomous "why can't you think of a good way to ask or do something that will get me in the mood like giving me a back massage" and my response was "I hate giving you a g*d d*mned back rub". So that killed any mood I had there. She then proceeded to chew on me for the next 10 minutes about how I need to be more willing to "show" her that I would like to "make love".

I love my wife very much, and outside of this, we have a very good relationship. We have 2 boys, 5 years old & 1.5 years old. But the sex well pretty much started to dry up after our first son. So much so that after our second boy was born I started keeping track of how often we had sex (after she was able to after giving birth) and how often I got denied my request. I never added it up until today and it really is a shocker to me. Since mid May of 2009 the yes comes in at 31 times and the no-gos are a grand total of 98. That total is for a 56 week period. Yeah, I know, it probably doesn't say too much about me for keeping track, but I am pretty worried about us as lovers & as a married couple. Any time I broach the subject, she gets very defensive about it and turns it around to be my fault that we don't have sex more often. It isn't me. I ask the only way(s) I know how. She comes home from work (a teacher) and falls asleep on the couch for 1-2 hours
every night, falls asleep on the couch after dinner or around 9 and then gets up and goes to bed. When I try to follow her to bed it is always the answers I gave above.

I have tried the flowers, tried lingerie, tried doing and saying the right things (what I think they are). What can I do to help the situation? Her sex drive is nonexistent and I can't do anything right when it comes to asking about sex with her. I have never thought of cheating on her, but….well, I don't want to. Put it that way. Any help will be appreciated.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

I don't know if her sexdrive is non-existant. Sounds more to me like she hates being asked. She prefers, intimacy, love, being loved.

If you read alot of the threads on here, you'll find that buying flowers, lingerie comes across as "bribbing for sex". She mentioned a back massage, you answered with I don't want to give you a gdmn back massage...

She's viewing all you want is sex.

Where's the love?

When a woman just feels like you "need" sex from her, in/out/in/out, done. ahh thanks. Then she feels like a piece of meat.

We are emotional creates, that need hugs, kisses, love... And, when we feel that the man is in love with us and wants a "connection", intimacy, sharing that love further, bonding, sex is not sex, it's all of those words and we'll give till the cows come home.

Stop asking... Let her sleep, run her a bath... when she wakes tell her you put a hot bath on for her. Don't ask or intimate any sex... It's just a caring thing, a loving thing...

Change your whole pattern. Send text messages, hope your day is good x... things like that.

Keep sex out of it for a couple of weeks, your used to it When your going to bed, just hold her... touch her forehead, kiss her good night...

Then after some time, when your in bed together, instigate "love" making... no words.. and not sex.

CW

[jns]

I think your lines are not very good. They need to be reworked and have more variety. You need to learn how to give her as massage and how to enjoy it. Do you bring her to climax during sex?

[Mes T]

I agree with CW. Seems like "intimacy" is missing. Unlike some men, women don't get much out of "in out in out wham bam thank you ma'am."

[LanaBear]

Women are very mental and emotional beings... It doesn't really sound like her sex drive is NOT there, but rather, she thinks you are in it for a wam bam thank you ma'am kind of lay.

First, yeah, we understand that you are resentful, trust me, I know... But you've got to let go of it. Start from square one. 5 years ago, my hubby got a lot less yes's and a lot more no's than you do now.

You've got two young children and she works, trust me, she is BEAT DOWN by the end of the day. Does she get any ME time? Can she lock herself in the bathroom for a bubble bath and not have the kids pounding down the door? When was the last time, just the two of you had a night alone? Does she think a kiss in the kitchens automatically has you wanting sex?

Not a fan of flowers, they die... Lingerie, at this point, no, because guess what it's screaming at her that you want sex. You need to work on getting that out of her mind, that just because you want a kiss or a hug doesn't mean that you want sex. Work on getting her to WANT you.

Leave her random little notes, not sexual, just complimenting her or telling her you love her. Send her random texts through the day, for me, this NEVER gets old and I smile numerous times a day when I get them. Place one red rose (yes, I know, I'm anti flowers, well, unless they are tulips) on her windshield with a card that says, "My life is better with you in it. Love you forever." Draw her a bath with different oils, lavender, etc., when she gets home and tell her you are taking the kids for a walk for an hour, ice cream, to the park, whatever and that you want her to enjoy some alone time, no cleaning, housework, dinner, etc. Plop down on the couch next to her and rub her feet (without her asking and yes, I get that you HATE it, but do it anyways).

Do all this for a while without expecting anything in return. Yes, I know it sounds one sided and yes, I know it isn't fair, but someone has got to start somewhere and unfortunately until she can find out from you on a consistent basis that you want more than just sex, you'll have to put some extra work into it.

Hopefully, as time goes by, the more intimate you two become again, the more sex you have, the more she will want it, realize what she has been missing. Also, as the kids get older and more self sufficient, less needy, it's AMAZING what that does for ones sex drive and enjoyment of sex.

Bring back the intimacy, the romance of what drew the two of you together in the beginning. Make it fun for her, intimate for her,

[janna125]

I agree that she seems to resent you asking her for sex. Women "get in the mood" by feeling loved. There may also be more going on with your wife. She may feel overwhelmed and tired from taking care of 2 boys and working and sex is the farthest thing from her mind. Do you do other things for her like help with child care and housework? She may have lost the desire for sex and that is something you two will need to address together. Maybe you should consider couples counseling so you both can talk about exactly what you need from each other. Good luck!

[Gearhead]

Ok, I completely understand where each and every one of you is coming from and what you are saying. I also went back and re-read what I said and it does sound like a cry for "poor me, poor me". What I really should have made the point of is poor us because there really is not that much intimacy on either of our parts anymore. So, I'll answer the questions y'all have asked or hinted at

JNS, I did the back massage for 12 of the 13 years we have been together. As a matter of fact, her sister & mother both have asked me on a regular basis to give them back rubs because my wife brags about how good I give them. I am sick and tired of giving them, I work with tools all day long, so my hands are tired at the end of every day (I'm in construction 4 days in the field 1 day in the office, which is significant and I will get to later). I know it sounds like an excuse, but my hands are sore every day. I have asked her to reciprocate in the massage department and she rolls her eyes and laughs at me. As for climax, she says that yeah, I do bring her to it, but like every other woman I have known, not every time. I'm not that much of a fool to think that I have the golden hand, if other things

CW, I have tried the emotional stuff. I offer to draw her baths on a regular basis and she never wants them. I stop by her school & bring her lunch on a regular basis, no strings attached and have never alluded to anything. I quit leaving notes on her car window because she never acknowledged them (and they were in a school parking lot) or when she did, it was that she "found something strange on her window". I hold her every night when I get into bed, no matter if we do or don't have sex or if she is asleep or awake when I get there. I cannot fall asleep without at least my leg touching some part of her body. We are truly a perfect fit when it comes to our bodies lying together (non-sexually). When ever I try to give her an emotional kiss or hug, she pushes me away and says "the boys might see us". Like she doesn't want them to know that we love each other. And as for the sex that we do have, lately she has asked me twice in the past 2 months if "I was done yet". Makes me feel really wanted...

Lana & Janna, yes, she gets all kind of me time. I take the boys with me when ever I can. The two of them mean more to me than anything else other than my wife. I try to give her as much alone time as possible, especially when it comes to the boys because I know they can be a handfull. As I said before, we are coming up on our 10th and for that, I am taking her out of town to a hot springs spa where it will be just the two of us for 3 nights. I bought us a couples massage package and a dinner to a nice restaurant. The big problem is that she is going to be calling whom ever is watching our kids (either her parents or mine) at least 2-3 times a day checking on them. She doesn't know how to relax. I do 90% of the cooking in our family, I know what the kids like to eat better than she does & it really bothers her that I do. I also take them to the baby sitter & school every morning but she picks them up. The one day a week that I am in the office, I have both boys with me, so I am daycare 1 day a week. I am lucky, it's a family owned company that their grandfather owns and he gets to see his grandsons once a week. It has been that way since my oldest boy was 5 months old and will continue until our youngest goes to kindergarten. I have my chore list but the kitchen is mostly my domain because I am the one making the messes in there. As for the rest of the house, we pretty much have a 50/50 split on the work. I also take care of our dog, the yard work (except her vegetable garden) and I am a shade tree mechanic so that we don't have to waste money on a professional mechanic doing vehicle maintenance. I think that she thinks that everything I do is an allusion to sex. Some of it, yes, I'll admit it is, but for the most part, during the day, I am a business as usual type of guy and get done what needs to be done whether it is around the house or at work. As for the couples counseling, I brought that up a couple of years ago after our first son was born and we were going through the same thing. Her response to that was that we didn't need it and we could get through it by ourselves. And in turn she decided to have sex 3-4 times a week for about a month to try and make me forget about it. Then it went back to the same routine and I just said screw it and went along with what we were doing rather than try to fix the problem.

Neither one of us can be accused of being intimate with the other, I'll admit to that. But when I try to I get shut down automatically. Doesn't matter if it is in the kitchen for a good hug and a kiss or if it is in bed. Anymore, I have just thrown a line out there to see what kind of excuse I can get from her when I already know the answer, it's become almost an inside joke that I am the only one that is aware of. I have tried doing the "I'm not going to have sex with her until she asks me for it and then it will be my turn to shut her down" routine, but that doesn't work. It resoundingly blows up in my face. I tried that one time and we went something like 7 months between sex and almost a month between kisses....and those were just a see ya later peck on the cheek. I honestly believe that she has zero desire to be in a sexual relationship. I remember one time overhearing her tell my best friend's girlfriend that "now that I'm married, I don't have to put out" and that pretty well devastated me. I mean really, what is a marriage if the two people involved aren't intimate at some point or another? They are just roommates who share sleeping quarters. Which is what I feel like a lot of the time. Like I said before, I love her dearly, but I don't like her on a regular basis right now.

[LanaBear]

WOW! I don't know what to say after reading your response! I feel for you.

After reading this and granted it is just your side of the story, I think you need to broach the counseling again... It sounds like you do do a lot and I would be bent too. And to hear what she told her friend, that is pretty disheartening.

[Gearhead]

Another thing that might be good to know for you all is that she doesn't like to talk about sex, she doesn't like me to look at her naked (she has a very nice body, 5'8", 135-ish lbs., athletic build, long brunette hair, blue eyes....I could go on, but I'm sure that you aren't worried about that type of thing) and gets her clothes on as fast as she can after a shower, or at least her bra & panties. When we first got married, she used to walk around the house in the morning stark naked with a towel on her head. I know that says and has absolutely no bearing on the subject, but it kind of gives you a background and idea of the woman I have with me. Now, I'm not perfect, I know, but I want more than what we have right now.

I guess all I am looking for is something to help bring back the intimacy into our lives. I don't know how to do that, which is why I turned here first. I have nothing to lose with you folks, I am sitting behind a computer screen and hiding behind a user name to solicit some free advice. I will try pretty much anything at this point. So maybe something to get the ball rolling with our little weekend getaway???We are leaving next weekend (6/25) and I would really like to have some things up my sleeve to pull out to help. Me being an ever optimist, this might be something that is really the start of a "new" relationship for us....one can only hope. So again, anything!!!

[Mes T]

Hmmm.

Most of us have definitely experienced the diminishing of that "spark" in longer relationships, but I find it unusual that she would go from being totally comfortable walking around naked to the polar opposite. That, added to everything else, seems like a lot of changes. Is it possible that... she's having second thoughts about being in the relationship?