[atskitty2]

With the dust settled from the recent breakup, and having found dating to be a bit exhausting, I've been seriously considering trying something different for me. It isn't something I've ever done, and it isn't "me" by any means, but I'm thinking that stepping outside my normal limits may be just what I need right now.

I'm entertaining the idea of not looking for a relationship at all, and simply looking for sex, whether that comes in the form of a fwb arrangement or other sort of casual sex. It's been over 4 years, and since the forecast for a meaningful relationship is about as bright as January in the Midwest...I'm reassessing my needs and priorities.

I'm not morally opposed to these things, but I do know that I'll emotionally become attached to someone, which is a big part of why I've never done it. So I proceed cautiously, as I explore the idea. And, yes, effy, I'm analyzing the life out of this decision too! Probably "think" all the fun right out of it...

I'm just tired of waiting, tired of going without sex in some of the sexiest years of my life! I want to enjoy myself sexually...

Here's a problem tho' and I don't know if any of you may have some insights on why this may be, and if I can overcome it, or even if it is a problem. I don't find myself attracted to very many men. I mean, just raw physical attraction, in such a sense that I could just meet them, be attracted enough to want to hop into bed soon. I know it's all related to the fact that I need the intimacy first...but I want sex! But, I can't have sex with someone I'm not attracted to either. And, finding a guy I would like to have sex with, having them be available & also into me, is not a hugely likely scenario. Or, heaven forbid, they happen to be clumsy & completely inadequate in physical affection, as was the case w/my most recent relationship.

But, the fact is that, there really have been NO men I've met, that I've wanted to sleep with initially. The lust factor simply comes later for me, no matter how physically attractive they are. There are very few men I see that I just think, wow, I'd like to ....

I get so much attention from younger men, and I know they really just want to sleep with the older woman. And I'm thinking it wouldn't be so bad to fulfill a fantasy or two, while getting my immediate sexual need met (hopefully).

So, those of you who sort of "know" me especially, what do you think? Is it foolish for me to take this step now? Or, could it be just what I need to help me relax and at least leave behind the preoccupation with sex?

I know many of you here have had these sorts of casual encounters, ongoing or one & done. I know the topic has been discussed at length. What I'm really looking for here is feedback from those of you who have a sense of how I am, who I am...
My own friends have mixed feelings about it. One says I absolutely should break out of the box & at least give it a try. Another says I'll end up getting hurt.

[jns]

This will be away from your personality as it sits right now, but it may be what will help you grow in another direction. If it's what you want to do, do it enthusiastically, not timidly.

I think you won't have any problems attracting guys for such a situation. You can explore physical relationships outside of those who you would normally be attracted to which may lead to widening or shifting of your ideals. Still keep some tight controls on certain traits. Some guys are incredibly self centered and/or controlling and if I was you I would steer clear of them.

There is a possibility that you will get hurt by falling for a guy who is unavailable or has undesirable traits. It's a fine line on who to open up to. The lessons learned from such a situation are good for becoming more choosy the next time.

Best wishes.

[atskitty2]

Thx jns.

[cathygirl]

That need for intimacy is a natural in-born instinct, at least for women. Men want it too, but it doesn't seem to be a prerequisite for sex for them. I am not sexually attracted to anyone that I don't have any kind of intimate feelings for. Others find the idea quite tantalizing. I have a girlfriend who uses an online site to meet men for casual sex, and that's great for her. Never for me. I could not even advise anyone else because we are all so different, but one thing I will say - for the most part, if I was disappointed after having sex with someone it wouldn't be the end of the world. Life's too short to have that kind of regret. I'd just move on and learn what I learned from the experience. In other words, it's only as big a deal as you make it to be.

[atskitty2]

CW, I've "stopped" dating a few times, and gone back to it. Usually 6-8 month respites, after becoming so discouraged & exhausted with the process. Then, after my faith is restored, I'll go out again.

Driving home from work tonight, I thought, "who am I kidding?" Do I really believe I'm wired to be alright with these interactions?
I just don't know. Still a decision to be made.

[Something_Awesome]

Not to sound like a party pooper, but Kitty... I don't think you're wired for this. Once you go this path, you can't undo it. You can stop doing it, but you can't undo the hurt. I have to be honest... I could not believe this post. I had to take a minute to figure out it wasn't bogus. When I was reading your first paragraph I was already thinking "OMFG" as I was trying to anticipate what your new direction was going to be. My guess was that you were going to say that you will try dating women. As bizarre as you dating women sounds to me (I don't think women dating women is bizarre, I think you dating women is bizarre :P ), the whole FWB thing blows me away even more; I think that's a testament to how not-wired you are for FWB arrangements (at least that is how I perceive you). You give off no FWB vibes.

With that said, all your reasons for considering a FWB lifestyle are valid. Again, my issue is that you are not wired for this. I also have another beef with this whole FWB thing that I can't explain. I was going to use a metaphor but was thinking that it could get misinterpreted, so I'll say it another way. In a FWB arrangement the guy is not going to get "all of you," just "some of you." I guess that's the case in most FWB arrangements, but in your case you have so much more to give beyond casual sex than the average person. In a FWB arrangement with the "average person," there is not as much to be missed, so there is no tragedy to it (I am not being melodramatic; I'm just having difficulty expressing myself right now because I am exhausted from having a crazy weekend, and am numb from the shock of this post). What would be the worst is if you get attached and offer the guy all you've got and he won't do the same. That would just tick me off as well as most everyone else here as well.

If you're going to do it, at least let the guy be hot. I know you say that you don't see any guys you can lust after, but that may happen on its own once you get back to having sex.

I was about to end this post but something sort of relatable came to mind with regard to "wiring." I have a cousin that I used to be very close with. We had the bond of brothers. I've stopped seeing him and have not hung out with the guy for several years. I severed ties with him because he is a big liar. Even though he lied ALL THE TIME, his lying was not compulsive (it was not habitual). He lied because it got him ahead. It was a shortcut. He lied to me, his wife, his friends, his parents, and sister. He lied to everyone all the time even if it meant screwing over his loved ones. He lied because he did not care. He is a carefree person. I sometimes tell myself that it would be great to be my cousin for a day; to be able to lie and be carefree, and have the weight of caring lifted off my shoulders. Caring for others is stressful; it's a burden. Unfortunately, I am not wired like my cousin; I can't do what he does because I do care. So it's a burden I am going to have to bear. What I am trying to say is you may desire at least the physical component in a relationship just like I desire to not be as caring, but at the end of the day if you're not wired for it, then you're not wired for it.

There is one thing you said though that's very important and distinguishes your situation from the story above regarding my cousin. You said you were tired of wasting the sexiest years of your life. Time is a finite resource (duh). Once it's gone you can't get more of it. It can never be replenished. You're in your sexiest years and maybe you should be putting them to use because the "sexy years" will come to an inevitable end (for all of us). So FWB may be something worth trying, even when faced with the risk of being hurt pretty badly.

BTW, did I go from sounding melodramatic to morbid? Not my intention! Anyway, I am going to go to bed now and will hopefully have a better grip on this subject tomorrow.

[atskitty2]

Actually, SA, I've always been open to dating a woman. Had my eye on one last Spring I think it was. I'm not opposed to that, it's just never been reality. I find about as many women attractive as I do men, I suppose. I couldn't see myself in a relationship w/a woman long term, but I'd try dating, explore it. This particular girl was taken at the time, so I never approached her. I was attracted to her tho', didn't just find her attractive.

I cannot say how much I appreciate your response. This is what my gut was telling me, and I just wondered if anyone else saw that in me or not. I think there's a high probability I'll wind up hurt, because sex isn't just sex to me, it never was, and I doubt that I'll be able to master my emotions/thoughts about it, at this point in my life. I can't pretend I don't care about things that I care about...that mean something more to me...just as in the story w/your cousin.
It's a chemistry experiment, that I know is going to make a mess. So, I'm prepared for the explosion and have the appropriate decontamination gear & cleanup supplies standing by.

But, that's sort of another reason why I want to try it. I need to manage this, and I know I could if I must. It's a sort of challenge for me on an emotional level, but a risky one. I think I need to explore this area, stretch my limits & at least open myself up to it happening. It could be that, maybe I just allow sex to happen earlier after meeting someone. I have thought that's a reasonable compromise, to just seeking a sexual partner only. But then, it starts developing that relationship vs sex only sort of thing where my tendency to attach would interfere.

I'm still searching my way through this, analyzing data (just for you, effy) and trying to be honest with myself.
I just recently lost the weight I'd been hoping to drop-the last of the weight I'd put on during/after the divorce. I worked hard for that. It was symbolic. I'm moving on, it's time to enjoy my body again, & my life. I look great, I feel great & I want someone else to enjoy this body, and me! as much as I do! lol I feel really good about myself and I'm ready to make a new path for myself. I've treated myself to some new sexier undies, new clothes that fit, & I feel good about so many things. It's time someone shared the intimate parts of me again.

So, I've lined up 3 men to meet this week so far, with 2 others "on the hook". I've gone in a different direction selecting them. They are all younger, ranging from 29-34. I checked out their photos first, and made that a higher priority than usual. I've been much more flirty in my initial contacts than is normal for me. I gave up my phone number much more quickly.
I realize, especially the 29 yr old I'll see on Weds, that they are all probably interested most in sex, even tho it hasn't come up yet. Doesn't mean I have to go with it, if I'm not thinking it's the right thing for me then, but I'm open to that if it moves in that direction.

It seems that I'm calculating, trying to create or force something & I don't like that. It's just different. I'm not really expecting to have sex w/any of them this week, just planning to allow things to develop physically if they move that way. It seems like some sort of experiment I'm conducting...and I guess I am.

And lastly, as I have sort of just mumbled through this post and need to close it, I think the most recent bf scenario that failed physically, was a big indicator to me that the physical needs to take a higher priority much earlier. It is important to me, and I've not given it it's proper place until now. THAT has been the big realization & lesson from that experience. So this stems from that acknowledgement.

Hoping for more input from others...thanks again SA for your (especially) thoughtful response, and truly the compliment veiled therein..

[effy2014]

I think it only appropriate to respond since I have received two "shout outs" from one of the people I most admire. I read your post last night and wanted to mull it over before I responded.

As SA stated (and, of course, you confirmed), you are not wired for a purely sexual relationship. It has seemed to me that you need to be respected, cherished and loved and have a solid foundation for intimacy to have its meaning . . . and its pleasures. I get that because I have those same beliefs. The path you are gong down appears to be more of the casual sex variety as a solid friendship requires more time to develop then a glass of wine and dinner. It is also questionable whether a man in the 29-34 age range could really be that kind of friend.

If I may be sexist for a moment, you are in a different situation because you are a woman. Odds are you can have any situation of your choosing turn sexual. In that age range, there is also a minimal chance (but one to consider) that you will deeply hurt someone who was just an experiment but became attached to you. Therefore, you are probably "conscience free" to use one or two of these men to test your wiring and determine if a sexual relationship without emotional attachment is possible. The ego boost of a handsome younger man being sexually attracted to your new body might be very helpful for you emotionally. There are some very real pluses to your experimentation.

There are, of course, some potential negatives. A younger man seeking to bed an older (not old, of course ... I am old as I have been informed) woman may not truly respect your wishes if you have a change of heart midway through. If you do develop an attachment, even if it is just to the sex, you need to be emotionally prepared for him to walk away. These are concerns not unique to any particular type of relationship, but with a shorter vetting time, the wrong man might slip through.

As usual, you have analyzed your feelings and will make a well reasoned choice. I do not think that you can or will take all of the fun out of it if you allow yourself (in a safe manner) to go with the flow and just enjoy the physical. I will comment that the failure of your recent BF relationship was not entirely sexual. There were many red flags as I recall . . . sex was just one of them. Intimacy is and should always be high priority. However, from a relationship perspective there are also many other high priority criteria.

Have fun. You have intellectually prepared yourself for the potential outcomes. My only "advice" is to make sure that all things are safe for you.

[Something_Awesome]

I have more to say but don't have time to say much atm. Effy beat me to the punch as he sort of touched on this....

I find it much more likely that the guy will get sprung over you as opposed to you getting sprung over them. Which is OK. That's how it's supposed to be. Lol it would be quite unsavory if it were the other way around (I know, Effy and I are sexists). You should totally make them fall for you btw.

And about that woman you were attracted to... Kitty, for most people the shock would be if their new path was one where they would date the same sex, not a path of casuak sex. For you it's the other way around. The shock is you taking a path of casual sex.

Would I be wrong if I said I sensed that you thought about trying such "experiments" before your most recent break up?

Have more to say but have to go...

[Baboy]

Kitty,

I have been spending much less time here of late and, when here, I usually just read. However, while I do not have a great deal to offer, I feel compelled to respond to your request for feedback. You deserve whatever members here can provide.

Until today, I was unaware of the denouement of your recent relationship. It took some time to sift through 9 pages of detailed postings. Kudos to you and the responders for the descriptive, thoughtful and thought-provoking thread. I am convinced that you came to the right conclusion and handled the matter in the best way possible. I am very sorry that the relationship failed to blossom. There were certainly a lot of hopeful signs along the way, but clearly they were overwhelmed by the discouraging factors. It is clear you made a genuine attempt to make it work. While I think all relationships involve a modicum of compromise, a near complete selling out should not be part of the package.

Now, as to your current post, suggesting it might just be time to cast aside your usual conventions and indulge in casual sex. Should you decide to venture down that path, I suspect you'll be in for more frustration, irritation and disappointment. I draw sustenance for that view from your comments below:

[QUOTE=atskitty2;n737021
Here's a problem tho' and I don't know if any of you may have some insights on why this may be, and if I can overcome it, or even if it is a problem. I don't find myself attracted to very many men. I mean, just raw physical attraction, in such a sense that I could just meet them, be attracted enough to want to hop into bed soon. I know it's all related to the fact that I need the intimacy first...but I want sex! But, I can't have sex with someone I'm not attracted to either. And, finding a guy I would like to have sex with, having them be available & also into me, is not a hugely likely scenario. Or, heaven forbid, they happen to be clumsy & completely inadequate in physical affection, as was the case w/my most recent relationship.

But, the fact is that, there really have been NO men I've met, that I've wanted to sleep with initially. The lust factor simply comes later for me, no matter how physically attractive they are. There are very few men I see that I just think, wow, I'd like to ....
[/QUOTE]


You say you just do not see yourself as attracted to men just to hop into bed with. I do not think you need to do any soul-searching as to why that might be, or to define it as a "problem" or seek to change it. It's part of your makeup, has been for a long time, and it strikes me that it's not really in your nature to now make a radical shift simply to achieve sexual gratification. Rather, even if you can bring yourself to make such a change, it will be superficial and, yes, you might just end up in the sack with a few guys, but I see the prospects for a happy outcome as uncertain, at best. On top, you court disaster, risking the prospect of "clumsy & completely inadequate in physical affection" or even worse, someone who turns out to have a dearth of desirable traits, but who will resist being let go. No doubt some women are able to deal with such vicissitudes without a second thought, but I am not sure that is you. I see a leopard trying to change its spots.

I hope I do not come across as being too presumptuous, or negative for that matter. You have sought "feedback from those of you who have a sense of how I am, who I am". You have over 1,300 posts here and I have read but a fraction of those. From those I have read, I may have failed utterly in gaining any insight into the real you. Anyway, you are far too intelligent to place any store in the ramblings of one who has wholly missed the mark.

As in your previous thread to which I have referred, the men here have been the most prolific responders. Happily, CW and Cathy have shared some women's perspective and I dare say that the women can probably provide the best guidance in a matter such as this.

Like SA, when I read you initial post, supra, my guess was that you were going to say that you would try dating women. I did not and do not see that as bizarre. You candidly mentioned that you are open to that idea. Again, some of the women here may have better and more fulsome advice to share on that score, but I see that as perhaps offering you best chance for some sexual satisfaction without all the going against the grain, the risk, the drama, the disappointment, etc. that might attend casual encounters with men.

Finally, let me say that there is probably no decision you can make that will spell disaster. You are obviously intelligent, mature, capable and clear-headed. Undoubtedly you have sufficient intellectual and emotional resources at your command to make the best of any situation. Whatever you decide, if the result turns out to be disappointing, you'll recover from it without great difficulty or turmoil and learn from the experience.

I wish you all the best.

b