[CHANDLERS WISH]

I just suck it up that it's the man's job to grovel and be humiliated by 20 not interested's if at least one is a yes, and a chance for a date.

Oh dear.

This is why women hate dating sites, no offense.

That they can't be themselves rather feel that they have to grovel to get a date.

Wrong, in my opinion.

You click or you don't end of story.

Keeping on track of the OP's thread.

She has already weeded out those that pretend and this is what you are suggesting hun.

Grovel

[avgmale]

Obelisk, I think there is some merit in the method you describe, but think about how much guys actually have the balls to walk up to a woman in a situation like that and get a date from it. The fact you will do it doesnt say a whole lot about other males. As you said, males are expected to be macho and things like that and if we're not were getting shut down. Not everyone has the self confidence to walk up to a girl as not every girl has the self confidence to start smiling at males they like and opening themselfs up.

Dating sites are different for women and men but, Im not a very attractive male per se, probably a 7/10, and I can get multiple dates every week with women equally hot or hotter then me. I weigh about 120, 5'11 and balding allready . It IS all about that first message, especially if you're a male, you just have to be lucky enough that she reads yours after she read the other 20 she got that day. Females will respond on a much more basic level then a male would, partially because most of the messages they recieve are pretty terrible.

[Needytoo]

Yes, I think maturity does play somewhat into all of this, but in some ways we are all in the same boat. I have one friend that is 23 years of age trying the online thing, she said she had so many guys that were single fathers that just came out and asked her to babysit. But she did manage to meet a guy and they went out for their first date last week.

I totally agree that meeting a person is the way to go, just where do I go. I am not going to hang out at bars. In my area I really haven't found a place yet where singles my age hang out. I am going to join volunteer for a club and thinking about joining a bowling league. I have only told a few friends that I am ready to start dating again. Flirt!! I don't think I ever flirted in my life.

[atskitty2]

Not sure that I can contribute a lot here, but wanted to poke my head in and say hi! I'm a 41 yr old woman and I have been trying out the online dating scene for several months now. Obelisk, I wasn't online when i was younger, so I can't compare but I can attest to the shallow, desperate and scary characters on the free sites I used. My bff has used both free and pay sites and she says the pay sites are just a tad better, nothing appreciable.

I have met some good guys online, just not for me. I recently met a very nice man who I'm spending some time with, but have a sneaking suspicion I only have a good friend in the making. I'm OK with that scenario as well.
I have had some hilarious first meetings, and scary ones as well. For me, I'm taking a break from it all-its exhausting....

It seems to me, in evaluating my own purpose and intentions in dating, that the online route must be approached with a set of expectations that a higher percentage of the messages and meetings are from a set of people we wouldn't consider. It takes time and patience to wait thru the "losers", to find those there is actual potential with.
I am nearly 2 yrs out of a marriage, feeling ready but not desperate to find a partner and companion. I am not sure how my profile is perceived but I think my maturity and lack of desperation is evident in reading it.
I am pretty attractive for my age-little more weight than I'd prefer, but I get plenty of attention-usually from the wrong type.

I guess what advice I'm trying to give to OP is that it takes time... settle in and notice patterns. I have read enough profiles and chatted with enough men, that I feel I pick up on subtleties now and can spot things much more quickly.
Secondly, just have fun with it and relax-take a good belly laugh away and consider that a success...because that's the most you'll get from some chats. See the humor in the foolishness.
Be selective in who you meet in person, but meet as many as you can. It's really the best way to know for sure and rule in/out a guy.
Good luck! You're definitely not alone
Whoa, that was long!

[atskitty2]

*needy too, I'm in the same boat...not many opportunities to meet folks the old fashioned way. And I work a lot, an odd schedule so that doesn't help.

[Needytoo]

It is very hard to meet new people atskitty2. I had no idea this online dating thing was going to be so much work.

[Obelisk]

Oh dear.

This is why women hate dating sites, no offense.

That they can't be themselves rather feel that they have to grovel to get a date.

Wrong, in my opinion.

You click or you don't end of story.

Keeping on track of the OP's thread.

She has already weeded out those that pretend and this is what you are suggesting hun.

Grovel

Well the only way for what you are saying to work is for the guy and the woman to be part of something else entirely, and they meet by pure chance and click and all that fancy stuff.

Like if you are part of a club or organization to help needy people, you truly believe this and do what you can, you go out and give homeless people blankets and a warm coffee, etc.

Girl who does the same sees you, goes "wow what a great guy". Interest. She reaches out. Click, they date, find so much in common, get married.

Pie in the sky

Realistically, a guy has to reach out to women always. A guy always has to approach and ask out a woman. She gets to say yes or no. So the guy is always appearing to be the needy one (even though that girl desperately wants the guy to ask her out, but she doesn't have to show it, it's all on the man's plate to make that effort). So yeah, groveling and exposing to a humiliating experience.

One of the women I asked out a long time ago was a coworker in a retail store. We got along well, we laughed, we seemed to click. No move from her. I had to ask her out. Got a look of disbelief like "wow you want to go out with me?" hah hah. Didn't end well. Kid thing. Got slapped in the face.

I don't think I'm pretending btw when I ask out. I don't always wear tight clothing to "show off my physique". I try to limit looking like I'm a looks obsessed guy. I don't act like a "playa". I get better responses the "cooler" I look, and sometimes that requires showing off more.

Not sure what "be yourself" really means here.

I though about the club thing. I used to go to church, that was like a club. Only women interested were 10-15 years older than me. Maybe I should try it again. As it is my time is limited and becoming part of a club really would just be to try to find a woman. Not sure it's worth it.

If you believe that's the way to go, then others here should make the attempt.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

I believe the word is courting, not grovelling.

For the record, I handed my fiancé my business card after 2hrs chatting to him and asked him to call me. He did..

So it is not always the male that does the chasing or hard work..

Use the word "opinion" unless it's factual

[Needytoo]

Yes, typically it is the male asking out the female. "Experts" say men love the chase. I am not sure who these experts are. lol

Remember all your past relationships are in the pass, sure they can stir up emotions, let the emotions come in and go out. They are just emotions and never can physically hurt you.

Obelisk maybe a club is something too look into, but just make sure it is something you are interested in so you will feel comfortable in doing it.

[CaseyVidgen]

I would recommend OKCupid or POF over a pay site any day. Also, why would you want to be picking up boyfriends by smiling in the mall ? Thats probably the worst way of going at it if you're serious about finding someone.

I also think women need a lot more guidance in their online search then they seem to think but they are mostly just used to being hit on/getting messages and feel no need to improve.

I stopped using okc a few weeks ago after one too many awkward dates lol. My coworker showed me cliqie.com and I’m a big fan of that over the others in terms of actually meeting people vs. just entertainment. It has a different approach that feels less sketchy cause you and your friends essentially act as “wingmen”. I like that it helps you find things to do too. Skout’s okay too, but still has it’s fair share of creepers