[Irelandlover]

It is remarkable to see some of the threads. Many of the topics
are non-existent in non-western nations. The idea of oral sex
is one that is rather new, and the idea that a woman would
swallow ejaculate is unbelievable. Men pay prostitutes to do
that. As incredible as that is, the completely unheard of anal sex is a hot topic.
Any study made of the postings to this MB will discern that the
majority are cool with oral sex, with swallowing ejaculate and
anal sex. If you dispute, read the threads.

In some countries, among some cultures, virginity is important.
We know in Western nations it is treated as a curable disease.

Values depend on the society you live in.

Smoking, for example is banned in many Western Countries.
It is illegal. People smoke, but not in enclosed public places.
In other parts of the world, smoking is common and people
smoke everywhere.

Oh dear this is very naive of course oral sex goes on in other countries, other religions, muslim countries etc etc of course anal sex goes on it is just not discussed. People have been doing both acts for hundreds, thousands of years.

I find your comments DEEPLY OFFENSIVE regarding Virginity considered a curable disease. You know what you have read, who you have spoken to, probably watching Eastenders (ha ha ha) you do not know everything about our society and culture.
You are ignorant of it clearly as Virginity by many people is not seen this way.

As for your comments on homosexuality yes it is more common now, but you are not saying that it didn't exist years ago? Of course it did it just wasn't talked about openly. This doesn't back up your strange offensive opinion.

You talk about smoking yes in some countries it is illegal, take some of the muslim countries NO smoking and NO drinking - so what happens? Big groups of muslims come to England where God is obviously not watching them and they smoke and drink and try to sleep with the slappers. who has self control?? The man and woman who step out of the culture and cannot resist temptation/the devil. Or the man and woman who grow up with temptation around them but do not smoke, rarely drink and have one or limited partners. I know what the real test is and I know who I think god will see is not afraid of him, only afraid of the culture and is happy to lie and be deceitful when away from home.

[housewife]

You talk about smoking yes in some countries it is illegal, take some of the Muslim countries NO smoking and NO drinking - so what happens? Big groups of Muslims come to England where God is obviously not watching them and they smoke and drink and try to sleep with the slappers. who has self control?? The man and woman who step out of the culture and cannot resist temptation/the devil. Or the man and woman who grow up with temptation around them but do not smoke, rarely drink and have one or limited partners. .

what is that Irelandlover?
do you think that Muslims control themselves because the fear their culture.
I personally don't know what culture I belong to,
I lived in the Lebanon, Turkey, Ukraine, USA and don't know what exactly is my culture.
when I don't do something wrong that is because I fear God who exists in Lebanon, Turkey Ukraine USA and everywhere.


that is a big misconception about Muslims.

Cultures and traditions means nothing to me.

[rosewater]

At first, when I started reading this i felt bad for housewife, how everyone was treating her. As I kept reading then I saw how housewife then makes putdown statments about christians and the Holy Bible. Housewife, isn't that haram? Listen, I understand you were being attacked by people but just ignore them. Whocares, they will have to face God one day. I respect your religion and ask that you do the same for others please. You are right, God is everywhere.

[rosewater]

Some person made the statment that muslims believe in a different God because they say Allah. YOU ARE WRONG. Christians in the middle east who speak arabic say Allah, its an arabic word. When they pray in church they say Allah because that is how you say it in arabic. Around the world christians don't use the word in english.

[kaylar]

losing the topic/missing the point

As is usual in heated discussions, people move from the point
to attack, defence, retaliation, and sometimes, feeling themselves
pushed into a corner, do react in an antagonistic manner.

Cultures are different. This idea of 'everyone' or 'every where'
is so puerile, one expects it to come from the mouth of Miss
South Carolina.

I live in a country which is proud of its homophobia.
Regardless of what 'statistics' or 'historical' whatever
you would to wave about, Jamaicans consider homosexuality a sin,
and homosexuals sick. I think this is the only country in the
world which has hit tunes about homosexuality being sick.

Now I raise this point so that you will comprehend, that people
see things differently.

In some societies a girl who is not a virgin is shunned. No one
will want to marry her, even if she was raped. This is a fact.
This is real.

No one seems to much care how many sex partners a woman has.
She could have started screwing at the age of fourteen and had
a different man every week, or every day. This in many parts
of western culture is no biggie.

There has to be, at least a recognition that there are different
cultures who believe very strongly in what you do not believe.

[ami]

i heard that Mohammed married a nine year old girl. i also read recently a testemony from a mother whose husband wanted to give their 9 year old daughter to a 50 years old man. he belives that mohammed did that and it is normal. Did Mohammed married a nine year old girl? Does that make him a child molester?

[hotdogg]

"In some societies a girl who is not a virgin is shunned. No one
will want to marry her, even if she was raped. This is a fact.
This is real.

No one seems to much care how many sex partners a woman has.
She could have started screwing at the age of fourteen and had
a different man every week, or every day. This in many parts
of western culture is no biggie.

There has to be, at least a recognition that there are different
cultures who believe very strongly in what you do not believe."

UNBELIEVABLE! so do you think that a woman should be forced to act a certain way! to conform to societies ideologies or face the coneqences? sorry but it is **** like this, that keeps women second class citizens!

i am so glad i do not come from a women suppressing society like yours! how dare you assume that all western women sleep around! and for the ones who do, who the hell are YOU to be judging them!

so does your culture agree that men can do what they want! but women must conform or be judged? what a croc!

[rosewater]

Housewife, are you shi'ite or sunni? You know that Christains don't all believe the same thing. Just like shi'ite and sunni have some differences so, do Christians. I'am Christian and I have muslim friends. We respect each other. I have read many books about Islam and I respect it. Housewife, some people have read and heard wrong things about Islam and their minds are not open to hear anything else, it's sad but true.

EVERYONE please can we all respect eachother???

WE ALL ARE ONE UNDER GOD, WE ARE ALL WOMEN,MOTHERS,SISTERS,DAUGHTERS,WIVES.

We all want the same for ourselves and families. Let's come together as women, not push eachother down. Let bring each other up!!!!!!!!! Learn from one another, but respect everyone!! God Bless!!!!!!!!

[kaylar]

Rosewater, you understand the point perfectly.

People have different belief systems. One is not here
to 'judge' which is better as if it is a 'beauty contest'
or a pop quiz on ethics.

I don't think many American men would become hysterical
if the woman they married proved not to be a virgin.
That in other societies this might invalidate a marriage
is not offered as 'good' 'better' 'best' but as reality.

I think a lot of people hate when the microscope is turned
on their society, and react with anger. But just as those
in the west view Shar'ia law with horror, those in the
East view Western mores with horror.

I'll give you an example.

A Lebanese fellow met and fell in love with a very
beautiful Jamaican woman.

She engaged in sex with him, and he felt she must
be a **** to have done so, and began to treat her
not as an upper class lady but as a call girl...he
would call her when he felt like it, tell her to jump
in a cab and come to him.

Now in the early part of the relationship he had
been very good to her, treated her like a queen,
so at first she didn't catch the change, but then
she did and broke up with him, completely confused
as to how he went from potential husband to...'john'.

Anyway, she met someone else and moved on.

He, becoming more accustomed to Jamaican or
Western mores realised his error and tried to
repair the relationship, which of course was
impossible.

He was completely distraught and I felt so sorry
for him, I tried to make a reapproachment which
the woman rejected with vehemence.

Now had he understood that she had loved him
and that having sex with him was not an example
of loose morality; i.e. she'll have sex with anyone
but of her commitment to him, then perhaps they
would have married.

But because of his Eastern morality he did not
and was not able to align the fact that she,
unmarried, would have sex with him.

Now no one is 'right' or 'wrong' here. This is
just an example of the kind of cultural misunderstanding
that we are trying to address here.

To express anger or take a remark as insult is rather
amusing, because, as those who know Eastern men
appreciate they consider most Western women extremely
loose, as they would a prostitute in their own country.

If one reads the posts here one will be 'shocked', if they
come from a religious background, whether a strong
Christian or Jewish or Muslim family, that sixteen year
olds engage in sex with their boyfriends, (not fiances,
just a boyfriend they have at the moment), or that
oral or anal sex is discussed, because these are things
that aren't mentioned in other societies.

Many men in my country believed Bill Clinton, for example,
could not imagine his wife giving him oral sex, for many
men in my country will go to *****s for that because a
wife does not do that.
(In a way, imagine traditional Japanese society)
In fact, a man will attend a divorce lawyer's office and
say, "I was never unfaithful to my wife!" because he
does not consider getting a 'washoff' as sexual relations.

Because, despite everything, sex is a touchy subject,
the reaction is so vehement here.

I recall when some Filipinos who worked on a boat,
trapped some wild dogs to eat, and this was the big
front page shocker.

The Filipinos saw nothing strange about eating dogs,
and couldn't comprehend why they were arrested.

The judge, appreciating that there was a 'culture clash'
explained to them that people do not eat dogs in this
country and admonished and discharged them.

Now those who love dogs are reeling with the image
of men going out, seeing dogs wandering the street,
trapping them, killing them, cooking them and eating
them.

Those who view dogs as lunch don't feel that way.

[hotdogg]

so what exactly is your point?

i do not care what eastern men think about western women, they dislike western women because they have no power over us! they control the women in their society, and they can not stand the fact that western women can make their own choices with their lifes and do what they wish with their own bodies.

i think that is what you have a problem with! we can do what we like! and we do not have to save our virginity if we do not want too.

you like to put down other women! you are not better than anyone else on this board so stop acting like the sun shines from your ****.