[rcoreyus]

Generalizations are fine as a guide, but you need to remember that there are many cases where the general rule doesn't apply so you can't rely on it.

[Guest]

Generalizations are fine as a guide, but you need to remember that there are many cases where the general rule doesn't apply so you can't rely on it.

I agree.

[Obelisk]

I know that there are some men & women who have married their firsts. But I do believe this is the exception to the rule.

Yeah I agree that it's probably very exceptional nowadays. When I was in high school it wasn't that bad yet.

One was the minister's daughter. They told me that they lost their virginity at that retreat when they were 15. That surprised even me.

Yup, doesn't surprise me in the least.

[Justice]

I wonder about more women's take on what you guys are saying about women who have slept their way through school with every guy they run into. I guess my friends were FAR less active.

I believe all of my friends were virgins when they graduated high school. (Most of us went to Catholic elementary school and public HS) I think only one had even felt a even given a hand job at that point. I went to college (commuter school) and our group kind of split up after 1 year (out of HS). I know 1 started getting drunk and got pregnant twice in the couple years (had an abortion with the first one and then had the baby the second time) - both times were with the same guy she was with for a while. I am not sure how many guys the other girls had sex with. I believe two of my other (pre-college) friends both married not too many years later.

Re my closest friend from college and for a about 10-15 yrs after... (one had gone to my elementary school/church, another was Catholic as well, the others were not Catholic). The first one had a BF but they'd have heavy make out sessions but never had sex. The second one - was a virgin when she married - met the guy through a work friend and got engaged after only a few dates. They married about a yr out of college and she never has sex with anyone else. Two were total groupies of a local musician (a total player) both gave him oral sex (he did not reciprocate). The one doesn't date much and last I heard she was still a virgin. The other of those two started screwing around (one guy) got pregnant and married him and has been with him for years. A few close female family members - who I would know about - (blood and through marriage) all married fairly young and never slept with anyone but their husbands.

(My sister is quite a bit younger and I don't know about all of her friends and heck I don't know about her (for certain), but most of them married one of their first serious BFs. No "out of wedlock" babies in her extended group of friends - but I know that alone is not indicative, just another factor. And I know that most did not date a lot (of diff guys).) (A few friends have told me about a few of their friends that started sleeping around after they were divorced.)

One of the friends I am able to talk most freely now, did share that she was pretty active in her college days. (She looked at it as a liberating experience/time - She is in her late fifties, so I guess we are talking the 70's "free love" "Women's Lib" time) She has been with the same guy for many years now. (He had a semi-serious GF when they met, but eventually the two of them got together for the long haul.

I know this is antedotal and as a group we might be oddballs - and things likely have chanced- but even based on my guesses about a couple of the old friends I lost touch with, I think that the generalizations about women vastly under-reporting the numbers of guys they've had sex with, may not be entirely true. I know that I am a rarity being a virgin in my early 50's, but many of the women I know married young and never cheated on their husbands.

Since a lot of the guys writing in this thread seem to know mostly girls with supposedly large numbers - I really wish other women would post and see if any have info more like in my post.

BTW on the subject of "Gold Diggers" - This is TOTALLY not me - but if we are going to generalize - It seems to me that Guys base a lot on the women's Looks (even in these post - about women's looks, size, wgt) while women are less likely to date/marry based on looks - but more often one factor for a lot of women is a guy's Success (it can make a guy seem more attractive).

Although a sense of humor, and showing an interest in the woman (and her interests) can raise a guy up the (woman's) scale - but based on some of the poster's in this thread the main factor for their interest in a woman remains only her looks. (I am not implying all, just many.)

[Obelisk]

I think that the generalizations about women vastly under-reporting the numbers of guys they've had sex with, may not be entirely true.

Thanks for your insight Justice. I can't speak as an expert, but from what I've seen, I think personality, popularity, and upbringing all seem to play some part in where a when a person will lose their virginity. I know when I was in high school, sex was talked about a lot, but most people were virgins, guys and girls admitted it all the time.

In church as well, although I always had my suspicion about certain people, but someone getting caught in some gossip that they had sex outside of marriage was like getting branded with the mark of the beast, and feared greatly.

I feared getting a girl pregnant most of everything (since I did not, absolutely, under any circumstances want any children) and that's what kept me a virgin until my 30's. Religion played a part in it, but alone would not have been enough to stop me. The fear of kids was.

I think the new generation takes sex a whole lot lighter than we did. When I was in high school in the late 80's/early 90's, it was unheard of that a 14 year old would be sexually active. I'm sure occasionally it happened in secret.

Now it's the reverse, it's unheard of that a 14 year old is still a virgin. Wasn't there a post of a 19 year old girl who said she's had 4 partners already? My jaw was floored.

I keep thinking to myself, am I getting that old? Now I'm the old timer complaining about how things we're so and so in my day? lmao

BTW on the subject of "Gold Diggers" - This is TOTALLY not me - but if we are going to generalize - It seems to me that Guys base a lot on the women's Looks (even in these post - about women's looks, size, wgt) while women are less likely to date/marry based on looks - but more often one factor for a lot of women is a guy's Success (it can make a guy seem more attractive).

There's been massive discussion about this exact topic on this thread (most of it to do with ladder theory)

Basically we all size up, and are sized, instinctively based on ladder theory. What guys like rcoreyus don't understand is that this doesn't mean you're consciously choosing who's hotter and who isn't. He says he loves his wife. I believe him 100%. A really hot woman with features he likes might walk by and he'll do a double take. Ladder Theory took effect. It doesn't mean he's now going to get divorced and go after that new woman though, those facets of emotional attachment and loyalty happen in the higher brain and are out of scope of ladder theory's effect.

So I, again, would state that yes, men tend to instinctively prefer women that are more attractive. That doesn't mean that a man can't fall in love with an unattractive woman though, but this happens due to emotional triggers beyond the scope of ladder theory.

In the same way, women's attraction is more complicated. Simply being a "hot guy" isn't enough. There are more angles. Success is one of them, and this reflects in how he dresses, how much he earns, what he drives, etc etc.

This doesn't mean that a woman can't fall in love with an ugly rich guy, or a hot poor guy. This, again is an emotional response based on things like her upbringing and her natural personality.

I've never denied any of this, but my entire argument is that looks do matter, for both men and women.

[Guest]

Justice,

While I was in public high school, my friend knocked up a chick who was going to a Catholic high school. Her father made him pay for an abortion.

I know a Mormon chick who told me that her friends and she were all sexually active at 16.

Those religious chicks who lost their virginity at a young age were nerds. They went on to graduate from prestigious universities.

I did grow up during the '70's near the end of women's lib. My friends and I were having a lot of sex, which means a lot girls were having a lot of sex. I remember that for about a year chicks into women's lib had stopped shaving. That wasn't right.

Another chick I know comes from a lot of $$$. She screwed her way through high school and college. Her parents thought she was an angel. While she was in high school and her parents went out of town she'd call over a boyfriend she was dating at the time and rock his world in her parent's bed. She lost her virginity in her parents' bed at 15.

To my estimation, graduating from high school a virgin is the exception. I don't know of any chick who graduated from college with her virginity intact. A chick that I just met told me a few days ago that she lost her virginity in college at age 20. She's in her 50's now.

While it might be due to where I grew up (So Cal) and the era (Drugs were popular; however, I didn't do 'em.), as best as I can remember it, high school kids were having sex. In fact, I remember our principal telling us via intercom that he knew boys & girls were knocking off action in a nearby nursery, and he was taking steps to prevent it. When I began college it was as though I walked through the door of a sex smorgasbord. Very short shorts & tube tops were the attire of most chicks in college.

[Guest]

Obelisk,

If a 19 year-old girl has had only 4 sexual partners, my thought, if I had one, would be that she's conservative.

[Guest]

Taken form the Guttmacher Institute's Website:

Facts on American Teens' Sexual and Reproductive Health

June 2013
SEXUAL ACTIVITY

•Fewer than 2% of adolescents have had sex by the time they reach their 12th birthday. But adolescence is a time of rapid change. Only 16% of teens have had sex by age 15, compared with one-third of those aged 16, nearly half (48%) of those aged 17, 61% of 18-year-olds and 71% of 19-year-olds.[1] There is little difference by gender in the timing of first sex.

•On average, young people have sex for the first time at about age 17, [2] but they do not marry until their mid-20s.[3] This means that young adults may be at increased risk for unintended pregnancy and STIs for nearly a decade or longer.

•Teens are waiting longer to have sex than they did in the recent past. In 2006–2008, some 11% of never-married females aged 15–19 and 14% of never-married males in that age-group had had sex before age 15, compared with 19% and 21%, respectively, in 1995.[1]

•In 2006–2010, the most common reason that sexually inexperienced teens gave for not having had sex was that it was “against religion or morals" (38% among females and 31% among males). The second and third most common reasons for females were “don’t want to get pregnant" and “haven’t found the right person yet."[4]

•Among sexually experienced teens, 70% of females and 56% of males report that their first sexual experience was with a steady partner, while 16% of females and 28% of males report first having sex with someone they had just met or who was just a friend.[4]

•Teen sex is increasingly likely to be described as voluntary. In 2006–2010, first sex was described as “unwanted" by 11% of young women aged 18–24 who had had sex before age 20, compared with13% in 2002. For young men in the same age-group, the share reporting first sex as unwanted decreased from 10% to 5%.[4,5]

•Teens in the United States and Europe have similar levels of sexual activity. However, European teens are more likely than U.S. teens to use contraceptives generally and to use the most effective methods; they therefore have substantially lower pregnancy rates.[6]

• Three percent of males and 8% of females aged 18–19 in 2006–2008 reported their sexual orientation as homosexual or bisexual. During the same period, 12% of females aged 18–19 reported same-sex behaviors (any sexual experience, including oral sex), compared with 4% of males in the same age-group (includes any oral or anal sex).[7]

[Justice]

J
I did grow up during the '70's near the end of women's lib. My friends and I were having a lot of sex, which means a lot girls were having a lot of sex.
. . .
To my estimation, graduating from high school a virgin is the exception. I don't know of any chick who graduated from college with her virginity intact.
. . .

While it might be due to where I grew up (So Cal) and the era (Drugs were popular; however, I didn't do 'em.), as best as I can remember it, high school kids were having sex. In fact, I remember our principal telling us via intercom that he knew boys & girls were knocking off action in a nearby nursery, and he was taking steps to prevent it.

I was in HS end of 70's. In my class of around 700 I think there was one girl that I knew of who was pregnant (and she'd gone to the same Catholic elementary school - i guess there might have been a couple more - and even a few abortions - but I would say the number was very small. Although there were a couple HS I read about where something like 50% (mostly poor neighborhoods) of the girls had been pregnant - but that was maybe 5-10 years ago. (Almost sounded like a Law & Order episode).

When you mentioned the location I really would have to agree. That woman I mentioned who was quite active (in her late 50s now, so this was early mid-70's) she had grown up in CA, and had a very liberal upbringing.

Your comment about not knowing ANY. Makes me wonder how insular people's social groups are.

I used to "joke" that if I was not in a serious relationship by my 30's that maybe I'd start just fooling around with whoever I was attracted to... and I THANKED GOD that I had not done because then AIDS hit. There are so many complications of sex/relationships- mostly outside but also inside relationships. Not only pregnancies (I am with Obelisk on knowing I never wanted kids and I did not want to risk it), but STDs and then how crazy people get either obsessed or possessive or the like.

[Lady Syrinx]

[QUOTE=Justice;360558]

J
I did grow up during the '70's near the end of women's lib. My friends and I were having a lot of sex, which means a lot girls were having a lot of sex.
. . .
To my estimation, graduating from high school a virgin is the exception. I don't know of any chick who graduated t episode).
9
When you mentioned the location I really would have to agree. That woman I mentioned who was quite active (in her late 50s now, so this was early mid-70's) she had grown up in CA, and had a very liberal upbringing.

Your comment about not knowing ANY. Makes me wonder how insular people's social groups are.

I used to "joke" that if I was not in a serious relationship by my 30's that maybe I'd start just fooling around with whoever I was attracted to... and I THANKED GOD that I had not done because then AIDS hit. There are so many complications of sex/relationships- mostly outside but also inside relationships. Not only pregnancies (I am with Obelisk on knowing I never wanted kids and I did not want to risk it), but STDs and then how crazy people get either obsessed or possessive or the like.

I went to Catholic high school in the 90s (90-94 to be precise). I chose not to participate in the party scene, if you listened to the stories as told Monday mornings they sounded more like orgies of drinking and sex. My bet is that is mostly false bravado on the part of both genders. But I was a virgin at graduation. Some time between graduation and my French club trip to France I lost my virginity to my bf(now husband. I give him props for waiting over a year between us meeting and our first time. We,re only a few months apart in age but he still turned 18 first. He was also dating a the daughter of a cop so there may have been some fear of daddy too.