[hotdogg]

[quote=whilhelm;16198]why not just look at instructional books at barnes & noble then? those are full of pictures of sex acts.

it's not that they aren't attracted to their partner, necessarily. it's that they want something more - in addition to, in some cases.

many women feel upset by that. i can't say that i blame them.

real life pictures are better than drawings!

oh so now you speak for the whole male race? who says they need something more, if my hubby is working away why should i be bothered if he looks at porn, my husband wakes up with a boner every morning, if i am not their then he will get rid of it by jacking off (big deal) if i am horny (a big sin in your book) then i will use porn to jack off too. i am not looking for something more. i just want too kill the horny thoughts in my mind so i can get on with other things. those horny thoughts are about my hubby i love having sex with him, watching other people having sex makes me think about when i have sex with my husband and i like that.

your little statement proves you are just feeding womens paranoia by saying they are looking for something more! if these women actually talked to their man with out throwing a fit they might actually know and understand why their man enjoys porn.

[Guest]

oh so now you speak for the whole male race? who says they need something more...

...your little statement proves you are just feeding womens paranoia by saying they are looking for something more!

well of course they are looking for something more! i didn't say they need something more. in fact, my whole point here is that they do NOT need something more - they want something more. if they didn't, they wouldn't look at it.

that's a silly position, hotdogg. why the hell would someone go out to eat unless they wanted what going out to eat could provide?? if you're totally content to eat at home, you won't go out - it's because you want something more, something different, something special.

if you have a sexual relationship with another human being - and you choose to ADD jacking & porn, it's very obviously because you WANT the addition.

an addition - by definition, hotdogg - means something MORE.

this is a very basic concept.

if you have basic television & you choose to ADD cable - it's because you want something MORE. if you didn't, you wouldn't get it. simple.

and i'm not feeding women's concerns about porn - i'm confirming them. validating them. they are right to be concerned.

you're trying to have them all wear blinders & shove their heads in the sand so they can pretend nothing is wrong.

[hotdogg]

yer the only thing they are looking for is something to jack off too! BIG DEAL! CRIME OF THE CENTURY!


so is my husband suppose to stay in the house 24/7 in case i get horny! get real!

all the sex experts say that masterbation is good for you! it is funny that religous people tend to be the ones who disagree!

you probably think that it is a sin to keep the lights on when you have sex LOL!

SORRY TO DISAPPOINT YOU! but i will never be so insecure that i need to make a big issue over porn.

[Guest]

hotdogg where do you come up with this stuff.

who said anything was wrong with masturbation? when did we even start talking about that??

you just totally sidestepped my whole point. a trend i'm seeing with you - and with a lot of people who are afraid of those with religious conviction.

you can't prove my points wrong, so you sidestep & go for personal attacks.

liberals have been doing it for years.

"so is my husband suppose to stay in the house 24/7 in case i get horny! get real!"

are you even serious????

so your argument is that porn is a good thing because if i didn't have porn my husband would have to sit at my beckon call all day in case i got horny...

god forbid you have to go a few hours without a porn-free orgasm. that would truly be just about unbearable for you.

your position gets weaker every time you post, HD.

[hotdogg]

do not patronize me!

you are the one talking rubbish!

so what is the difference with masterbating to porn or just thinking about a sexual act?

you are the one who is side stepping the issues by trying to say that porn is SO DESTRUCTIVE!

YOU JUST IGNORE ALL THE PEOPLE WHO ARE IN GOOD RELATIONSHIPS AND HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH IT.

YOU BORE ME!

[Guest]

i'm devastated.

you are the one who is side stepping the issues

no, i have addressed every one of your claims directly. you have not done the same with mine. you usually respond with some teenage rant about not being told what to do, i don't care what you say, etc. if you have put forth any real arguments, i've addressed every one of them.

so what is the difference with masterbating to porn or just thinking about a sexual act?

this is what i enjoy about our discussions. you make my points for me.

there really isn't much difference is there? at least not so much as the viewer is concerned.

you don't have to exploit anyone in order to think about sex.

[Patribella]

You

WILLIAM, I'd just like to tell you how much you have helped me these past few weeks. I have been reading your posts and cannot even begin to tell you what a sigh of relief if is to hear a MAN speak the way that you do.

I have gone to so many websites searching for, particularly, a man who had some advice on this subject. I've found some, but nearly all of them have made it into some kind of jesus thing... Such as "I've escaped porn through Jesus." & "Everytime I think of doing it again, I think of Jesus." Basically, these men are not doing something because THEY themselves have realized and understand how detrimental it is to them. They do it because Jesus says so, which is next to fruitless because in all actuality this way of thinking is yet another way to deem yourself irresponsible and lacking any control for your actions. (But, To each their own I guess.)

Anyway, This was very very very far from what I was looking for. Simply put, these religion fanatics cannot help me because I am NOT religious.

I appreciate so much that everything you say (From what I gather) comes from YOUR logic and what YOU believe in, independantly of any religion. These are YOUR conscious decisions and I can see that you have dug into it as far as I have. I just wish that my fiance could have been wise and concerned enough to do so. You're obviously a very intelligent man, conscious of the many ways this world has found ways to profit from the digression of mankind - making our men and women loveless, apathetic rats in cages.

I was going to spend the rest of my life with this man. My 4 year relationship was destroyed by porn and His constant choices not to stop using it. All along he knew it was me or the porn and every time.. he chose porn.

I have researched the subject til I was blue in the face and I've run the incredibly disturbing sequences of the past 4 years through my head so many times that I honestly do not even have the strength to analyse my relationship yet again and write down my conclusions yet again, for everyone to read. But, I will soon enough.

But, thank you for not being just another pig in the march to nowhere. And Thank you for standing up and giving an active f-ck about what is going on.

[Guest]

wow - thanks so much. i'm really glad you have gotten something positive.

for the record - i don't want to give the wrong impression. i am religious. deeply. i guess i don't bring it into these discussions much unless someone asks because of the very reason you mentioned. people assume that if you think porn is wrong - you must be a bible thumper. then they take you less seriously.

my religious convictions are connected to everything i believe, obviously - otherwise i wouldn't hold them. but i also recognize that porn makes itself known as a detructive, evil presence whether or not you are religious. there's a very good & very easy case to be made against porn that doesn't need to involve faith.

i've got friends who arent religious and who don't use porn - because they don't need it. the same reason they don't eat pop rocks or fun dips. you just grow out of that kind of destructive compulsion.

others don't - like me - and have to work at walking away from it.

either way, i'm happy you have found some encouragement. please rest assured there are guys who don't use porn - normal, healthy, fun guys.

but the more evryone lies down & accepts porn - the fewer guys like that there are. human nature - people will do what you expect & allow them to do. and if my wife had been OK with porn, i'm sure i would be pathetically gazing at porn right now instead of writing this.

so i'll look forward to your sharing your experience & your ideas about this. please write it soon. i'm sure you have a lot to offer here.

as you can see, there are many people hurting - and many people confused about this issue.

[hotdogg]

no, i have addressed every one of your claims directly. you have not done the same with mine. you usually respond with some teenage rant about not being told what to do, i don't care what you say, etc. if you have put forth any real arguments, i've addressed every one of them.

NO YOU DO NOT!

YOU SIMPLY IGNORE PEOPLE who have good relationships and that have no problem with porn! you just like to side with the ones who have issues with it!

you just keep repeating the same old rubbish! porn is evil! porn is destructive etc. this is just your opinion this does not prove anything! you imply that people who are in very good relationships must have something missing if they use porn! (speak for yourself). you seem to think that only religous people are capable of having good relationships.

you like making these insecure women feel bad about themselves by implying that that their husband prefers porn to them! if they understood the reason why their husband liked porn they would understand that they have nothing to worry about.

religous people seem to think they have the right to tell others what is right and wrong! they seem to think that anyone that chooses to live differently are below them!

religion and logic do not combine! your religion tells you that viewing a sexual act is wrong! that does not mean it is! I AM NOT RELIGOUS so preaching the bible does not work!

the only way someone can be certain that their partner will never look at porn or even look at another attractive person is to find someone who is blind! problem solved.

you are blinded by religon so it is not even worth discussing this topic with you! you will just keep repeating the same old rubbish!

[Guest]

your perceptions of me & my opinions are entirely based on assumptions - i continue to point those out to you. and here's another one - you assume that i think people in good relationships who use porn are missing something. i never said that - you assumed it.

but hotdogg - we can clear this up in 2 ways.

first - you point out the time i EVER used religion in a discussion with you about porn. i challenge you to just find one.

second - in the other thread, i have asked you several times about the statement from the article YOU provided. i just want to know if you agree with it. it says that exposure to sexist or violent material can lead to bad attitudes.

so, let's recap:

1. show me one time i used religion with you
2. do you agree with the statement from your article?