[AngelicBunny]

I'm sorry you have the misfortune to know somebody like this. Yes, that man is a child sex-offender if he has sex with fourteen year-old girls. Although the word 'paedophile' actually refers to an attraction to girls who are pre-pubescent which excludes many fourteen year-olds, as many of them have already reached puberty by that point, they are still children, nonetheless. I don't know where you live, but if it is a country in which having sex with a minor earns a person a conviction of statutory rape, I would hope that you have or are intending to report him. Men like him should not be permitted to ruin children's lives because people wish to turn a blind eye. As for you, if he touches you without permission, you are well within your rights to press charges for sexual assault. I would exercise that right if I were you.

Now, on to the subject of porn, I very much doubt that porn turned this man in to a child sex-offender and general creep; it sounds like he has a very deep-rooted misogyny which he may use certain types of porn to feed. I have many, many male friends, all of whom watch porn in some variety or other and I am pleased to say that not only are they extremely intelligent, but they would never dream of objectifying women. They would never touch a woman inappropriately as they do not have the desire and they know they do not have the right. Unlike that man you know, they would certainly never have sex with children or feel the most remote desire to do so. I don't think porn creates monsters, I do think, however, that certain types of porn can be used to justify misogyny. This brings me on to my next point:

Pornography is a term that encompasses a multitude of attitudes and interactions between men and women, men and men and women and women. Different types of porn exist to appeal to different tastes. It's not all a case of 'see a girl who looks under-age being thrown about and called a **** by five men'. Just as the concept of 'sex' is comprised of a plethora of different tastes, attitudes, techniques, and motivation, so too is the pornography that is designed to both emulate and inspire all those different things. If all pornography consisted only of the type that shows bully-boys abusing women, I would have nothing to do with it, as it not only leaves me cold, but also leaves a nasty taste in my mouth; but luckily that is just one tiny fragment of the whole. There are other types that do cater for my tastes and they don't involve women being demeaned.

Just one other thing, some of the contributors in this argument seem to have lumped submission in with degradation, which is very misguided. In S&M, to be submissive does not equate to a loss of dignity or being powerless to prevent abuse. A Sub (like myself) has a very trusting relationship with their dominant partner. That trust is necessary because although aspects of pain can be involved with play, everything that happens depends on what the Sub wants, not the Dom. If a Sub doesn't want to be treated a certain way, their Dom would not do it. The last thing a good Dom would ever want is to cause their submissive partner distress. That is not what it is about. S&M porn reflects this trusting relationship exactly and although I can see why some people outside this genre of sexual activity might mistake submission for degradation, their perception is most certainly erroneous.

Oh, no I didn't mean it was because he watched porn, he only watches it because he thinks men are supposed to. He's also only attracted to women if he thinks he's supposed to. The point I was trying to make is that not all people who watch porn is smart, which is how I interpreted somebody else's argument (can't remember who) and he came to mind. And I will make sure that if he does anything innapropriate with this girl, I will do something about it. It's hard at the moment though, because his friends don't make contact with him anymore, his only friends are these 14 year olds. And I live in England, so I'm sure there's something that can be done about it. I just wish I did something to stop him... that was very hard for me, he's such a creep... I can never even look at him he makes me feel so angry and I burn in my chest. I hate him so much.

And whoever said we are biologically supposed to have loads of partners. Well what about mentally? I could only ever mentally love one man, and therefore sleep with that one man and see this one man naked. I am not old fashioned, it's just the way I feel. I don't want to share anything I have done with him with anyone else. And I thought doves were very loyal and had the one other

As for porn, well me and my boyfriend don't like the idea of looking at someone else. We trust each other so much, and don't need porn. We don't like it, and he calls people who look at them desperate men like *that creepy guy I'd rather not give names*, although we do know it's not just men nor desperate people, he just thinks it's odd.

I've given up on this topic though... Everyone's trying to push their views onto each other and it's just not getting anywhere. People aren't even TYING to understand other people and then it gets hard to try and be polite or understanding yourself because what you've written isn't being understood the way it should. It's pointless and noone achieves anything other than insults.

[ONLE_U]

For once I laughed about the issue

I know it may seem silly (or petty)
but hotdogg...u made me laugh about the issue.
I can see the 'lazy' factor now...and u made me laugh, thank you

[Iseult]

Oh, no I didn't mean it was because he watched porn, he only watches it because he thinks men are supposed to. He's also only attracted to women if he thinks he's supposed to. The point I was trying to make is that not all people who watch porn is smart, which is how I interpreted somebody else's argument (can't remember who) and he came to mind. And I will make sure that if he does anything innapropriate with this girl, I will do something about it. It's hard at the moment though, because his friends don't make contact with him anymore, his only friends are these 14 year olds. And I live in England, so I'm sure there's something that can be done about it. I just wish I did something to stop him... that was very hard for me, he's such a creep... I can never even look at him he makes me feel so angry and I burn in my chest. I hate him so much.

And whoever said we are biologically supposed to have loads of partners. Well what about mentally? I could only ever mentally love one man, and therefore sleep with that one man and see this one man naked. I am not old fashioned, it's just the way I feel. I don't want to share anything I have done with him with anyone else. And I thought doves were very loyal and had the one other

As for porn, well me and my boyfriend don't like the idea of looking at someone else. We trust each other so much, and don't need porn. We don't like it, and he calls people who look at them desperate men like *that creepy guy I'd rather not give names*, although we do know it's not just men nor desperate people, he just thinks it's odd.

I've given up on this topic though... Everyone's trying to push their views onto each other and it's just not getting anywhere. People aren't even TYING to understand other people and then it gets hard to try and be polite or understanding yourself because what you've written isn't being understood the way it should. It's pointless and noone achieves anything other than insults.

It's most definitely a shame that people have become so angry with each other in this thread because interesting ideas have been put forward from people on both sides of the discussion. I suppose my personal view on things of this nature can be summed up by the phrase, "To each, her or his own." If pornography is not appealing to you then there is absolutely no reason why you would need to view it. In the same way, to those whom (legal) pornography does appeal, then they should not be made to feel like deviants for enjoying it.

Obviously the issue becomes more complicated if one person in a relationship sees no harm in it and their partner does, but compromises can be reached in such situations. The person who feels threatened by it should take on board the fact that their partner's viewing porn is not a reflection on them and does not diminish their partner's feelings for them. The person whose partner feels threatened should seriously consider their distress and work through the issue with them, taking care not to be selfish or inflame their partner's insecurities unnecessarily. That might involve making more of an effort and spending more time with their significant other instead of viewing porn all the time. Obviously, to neglect one's SO in favour of porn is not conducive to a happy relationship. I think it's ultimately about balance.

Going back to your post, you're right; we are not biologically supposed to have more than one partner. There has been evidence to imply that we might, but nothing has been proven, (nor can it ever be proved, as is the unfixable nature of all theories in psychology) so don't worry about that. It seems to me that people are all so very different that some are bound to be inclined towards monogamy and others are bound to be inclined towards polygamy. If you and your partner are happy in a monogamous mindset then who are others to tell you differently? It's lovely that you've found someone whose ideas on the subject are so compatible with yours.

[MT Momma]

Hubby addicted to Porn

it's the porn that bothers me. it's that my hubby of 17 yrs will not touch me - ever. Its been about 11 months since we last had sex. I travel for my job and everytime I am out of town, he buys new magazines and movies. But when I'm home, nothing. This last time I was out of town for 4 days and my daughters cought him watching movies and found him in the garage naked doing you know what while looking at magazines. He's been a total *ss to them ever since. I cant seem to figure this out. any advice is greatly appreciated

[Guest]

Maybe he's just not attacted to you anymore and prefers the porn over intimacy...Tell him to go get help.

[MT Momma]

And I'm ok with that. But he needs to be more careful - my kids don't need to see this

[alibaby]

And I'm ok with that. But he needs to be more careful - my kids don't need to see this

You are right about that! That's a shocking sight for a child to see which can affect them for the rest of their life. Seems that your family situation has seriously deteriorated as a result of your husbands behaviour. The best you can do at this point is seek marriage or family counseling.

[MT Momma]

agreed! have tried to get him to go a few times, but no luck. I guess I will start going again myself - but that doesn't help him.

[alibaby]

Take care of you and your girls.

Then you go and it may also benefit your daughters, considering what they have witnessed. If your husband can't see that you are making a serious effort resolve your families situation, then you may be pushed to that last resort of proceeding toward ending your relationship. Sometimes that's what it takes for the spouse with the problem to accept that they need help. You can't make him change his behaviour. He has to want that for himself. In the mean time, take care of yourself and your daughters.

[Guest]

And I'm ok with that.

i would like to urge you NOT to be OK with that. you both deserve more from each other.

do you have an interest in seeing him healed - other than just for your kids' best interest? porn tends to pull a veil over a guy's head - tightly. so he sees everything through that filter. and there could be a lot of terrifying shame waiting to be exposed if he were to take off the veil.

has he refused counseling because he doesn't see porn as a problem? or because he is ashamed & doesn't want to talk to anyone about it?