[mr.mansview]

dude and anonymouswhitefemale (the male version) you may be a representation of a male in your "world" but thankfully not in the real world..you can rationalize the "need" to watch porn to your g/f or yourself anyway way you want but it does not make it acceptable behavior in a relationship, especially when the women feels debased..(p.s.) a free and independant male who doesn't like to be shackled by a wife or g/f should put in the effort to get his own account, otherwise anonymouswhitefemale will show up on a lot of ""ignore posts"..

[anonymouswhitefemale]

Haha.

Well, I'm a real person in a real world, with real opinions.


Maybe I should put in the effort to get an account, but I don't think that's important really. I signed up the account anyway to help with a problem my girl has/had.

And I know my gf would be better off without the opinion of someone narrow minded enough to ignore someone because of their point of view.


It's not a need, it's a want. And do you have a problem with rationality?


And okay, so let's assume that porn in any relationship is wrong; let's break up about 80% of couples then. I'm just one of the few men who'll admit it, almost everyone does. So, that makes all women right, and all men wrong I suppose. Why am I not suprised?

[mr.mansview]

i did not say that if a man is viewing porn in a relationship that the relationship must end..you said if we "assume that porn is wrong then all women must be right and all men wrong"..why didn't you just say "if we assume that porn is right then men are right and all women are wrong..you must be a professional spin doctor..

[lilylenay]

to the person above my post...I think you're being very rude. ok the girl can't help the way she feels so why make her feel worse with your hateful words?! sigh...seriously? yes they are men but that's not an excuse and if you think it is then I feel very sorry for you. women could look at that **** just as much and some do so don't play the he's a man card.

But sadgirl you really need to think about how all this makes you feel. would you be happier with him or without him and this issue? I know it's not as easy as it sounds but you have to be true to yourself always girl. If you aren't no one else will be ya know? Good luck to you!

And honey there are men out there who aren't obssesed with checking out nasty women and watching them have sex. Good luck and let me know how it goes. If you ever need to talk I'll help if I can

[lilylenay]

when i said person above me i meant anonymouswhitefemale

[lilylenay]

my bad thatw as for kate not either one of you I didn't realize there were six pages of this and i was replying to her post as well as the girl who initially started this thread

[hotdogg]

anonymouswhitefemale, i agree with you!

their is nothing wrong with watching porn, my husband watches porn i have never had a problem with it, we both love sex and he is completely satisfied sexually, but i know that masterbation is good too, it is nice to have time just for you!

i watch and enjoy porn too, and i am a women last time i checked, so it is a load of rubbish when i hear women saying that women do not like porn.

in fact i find it a very narcaracisstic view, to expect your partner to only share orgasms with you. are you really so insecure that you expect to control every aspect of your partners life? to me this shows lack of trust.

and in response to chelsea, my man knows i watch porn, and it does'nt bother him at all, my man knows i love him and he knows he satisfies me completely.

i know that a lot of the women here have a hard time understanding why men like porn. however that does not give you the right to tell men they are wrong.

i also think anonymouswhitefemale, was right, who are you to say what a real man is? and please when you make a point please do not refer to it has a womans point of view! it is your point of view.

i do find it laughable when people say a real man would'nt do that, say that, act like that, etc! maybe the same could be said about women, a real woman, wouldn't be insecure, petty etc.

if you really hate porn so much why bother trying to control your man, why bother, you will never be happy and you will not stop checking up on him anyway. so look for a guy who does'nt look at porn, you all seem so convinced that their are lots of guys who hate porn? go and date him?

however you really know that these guys are in the minority and thats why you would sooner stick with the guy you are with and try in vain to change them!

[anonymouswhitefemale]

i did not say that if a man is viewing porn in a relationship that the relationship must end..

No, but you say that it is unacceptable behaviour, and if you complain about it to your boyfriend the outcome will be like this:

5% do what you say, and still fantasize about other women.
30% will dump you and move onto a more secure woman.
65% will lie to you and say they have stopped watching it...

So, given that this thread is about men lying about it, that can't be what you want. So, this spells a doomed relationship IMO.

you said if we "assume that porn is wrong then all women must be right and all men wrong"..why didn't you just say "if we assume that porn is right then men are right and all women are wrong..you must be a professional spin doctor..

I hate to be the one to tell you this, but you're the one who's spinning this. You are the one who reversed the sentance. I'm a spin doctor for telling it the way it is, eh?



hotdogg, you have no idea how glad I am to see a woman on here agree with me, I was starting to lose hope in the gender a little. You seem to be a liberated and free woman, who's managed to put a few of your psychological problems on hold for a better life.

Some of you here should try to take a leaf from her book...

And to the girls who hate porn, have you EVER thought about sex with anyone else but your partner from the moment you kissed them? If you say no I know you are a liar.

[Guest]

Some of you here should try to take a leaf from her book...

forgive my laughter.

anon - you're getting angry. why? i told you i disagreed with you & i explained why i disagreed with you.

yep, one who get's paid, and one who chose to follow that path. Let's not start the discussion on whether porn stars are abused, some are, some aren't, some are happy, some aren't.

well, at least you admit it - which is more than most porn users do. doesn't alleviate the negligence, however. your sexual gratification is never important enough to warrant using another person - regardless of their choice, payment, or anything else. period.

it's a discussion that was started a while ago & one i feel very strongly about.

I don't have enough happiness in this world. Why should I let things stand in my way of it? I don't see how an individual persuit of happiness can preclude you from sharing a healthy relationship with someone else. I'm very independant, maybe more so than my partner, I don't need to share everything in my life. I don't need to do this to maintain a relationship, either.

you're assuming that i think pursuing happiness keeps you from a healthy relationship. that's not what i said - not what i intended, anyway. hard to communicate everything in 2 dimensions.

my point is that in a relationship - and i'm refering to marriage, which might make a difference, not sure - but my point is in response to the attitide that i gleaned from your original comments. you seemed to resent that a girl would ask you not to get off with porn, when she isn't willing to have sex every time you're in the mood.

is response, i'm saying that your happiness in that moment needs to take a back seat to hers. if your pursuit of happiness in a given situation causes her the lack of happiness - especially if it's just temporal pleasure you're after - then you need to set it aside.

just like the analogy to the kid's PTA meeting. don't get so personal & defensive. i never said you wouldn't be able to parent a child. i'm saying, in general, that being a man involves handling disappointment with poise. there are many things we want that we have to sacrifice for someone else - a spouse or a child. if you feel patronized by that, go right ahead. it's not my intention, but i couldn't feel more strongly about any statement i've made. being a real man - responsible, selfless, dependable, strong - involves accepting the very disappointments that you are citing as justification for using porn.

I like how a few women in this thread have telling us men what it means to be a real man. To be honest, "a real man" isn't something that exists, and certainly isn't something that can be defined by something that a woman wants. I'm sure you'd jump down my throat pretty quick if I started telling you a "real woman" must always be receptive to sex, or cannot masturbate or something.

So, kindly shut up about a man/real man distinction, as every man is real.

nothing could be farther from the truth. if you're mincing words & talking semantics, then, yes, every man is real. they are all physically real.

i think you knew that i was talking figuratively. some men are dependable, some aren't. some men are considerate, some aren't. some are honest, some lie. some are caring, some are selfish. the list goes on.

if you truly care about your wife - or girlfriend, for that matter & depending on how serious you are - your pursuit of greatness will never stop. the day you stop trying to improve yourself is the day you to a disservice to your family.

porn is entirely selfish. porn is thoughtless, self-centered, and dangerous. there is nothing admirable or edifying about porn. at its best, it's like a candy bar. at its worst, it's rat poison.

can you show me, using either extreme, why any man wanting to be his best would indulge in either?

Stop fighting about minor points like porn and use that energy to make your man not want to leave you.

ludicrous.

this sounds like it came from a 12 year old who's mad he didn't get to stay up late last night.

we don't use our energy to make our partner not want to leave us.

[anonymouswhitefemale]

forgive my laughter.

anon - you're getting angry. why? i told you i disagreed with you & i explained why i disagreed with you.

I'm not angry at all, and I forgive your laughter.

yep, one who get's paid, and one who chose to follow that path. Let's not start the discussion on whether porn stars are abused, some are, some aren't, some are happy, some aren't.

well, at least you admit it - which is more than most porn users do. doesn't alleviate the negligence, however. your sexual gratification is never important enough to warrant using another person - regardless of their choice, payment, or anything else. period.

it's a discussion that was started a while ago & one i feel very strongly about.

Okay, you feel strongly about it, but this is not the discussion at hand. People are "used" for things in return for other things all the time. I'm used to fix someones computer, and I recieve financial reimbursement. That's the bloody economy. If a woman isn't willing to work in porn, she shouldn't. That ends the argument, at least as far as I'm concerned. Many pornstars are happier than the girl working behind the till at a supermarket.

I don't have enough happiness in this world. Why should I let things stand in my way of it? I don't see how an individual persuit of happiness can preclude you from sharing a healthy relationship with someone else. I'm very independant, maybe more so than my partner, I don't need to share everything in my life. I don't need to do this to maintain a relationship, either.

you're assuming that i think pursuing happiness keeps you from a healthy relationship. that's not what i said - not what i intended, anyway. hard to communicate everything in 2 dimensions.

my point is that in a relationship - and i'm refering to marriage, which might make a difference, not sure - but my point is in response to the attitide that i gleaned from your original comments. you seemed to resent that a girl would ask you not to get off with porn, when she isn't willing to have sex every time you're in the mood.

is response, i'm saying that your happiness in that moment needs to take a back seat to hers. if your pursuit of happiness in a given situation causes her the lack of happiness - especially if it's just temporal pleasure you're after - then you need to set it aside.

I'm saying that if someone tells me not to do something, it's unlikely that I'll listen. I do not like to be controlled by anyone, just as I'm sure women don't like to be controlled by their men. I never said I resent it, or them, just that it's something that I wouldn't want in my life. You say I NEED to not claim immediate happiness, for what reason? I'm sorry, I just don't see it. Low self-esteem cannot stop you from doing things. Should one never speak to any female apart from one's partner for fear of them getting upset because they have no self confidence?

just like the analogy to the kid's PTA meeting. don't get so personal & defensive. i never said you wouldn't be able to parent a child. i'm saying, in general, that being a man involves handling disappointment with poise. there are many things we want that we have to sacrifice for someone else - a spouse or a child. if you feel patronized by that, go right ahead. it's not my intention, but i couldn't feel more strongly about any statement i've made. being a real man - responsible, selfless, dependable, strong - involves accepting the very disappointments that you are citing as justification for using porn.

Here you go again saying what "being a man" is all about. This is a SUBJECTIVE opinion. It's yours, not mine. It was your patronizing attitude and calling me a baby etc. that was patronizing, not what you say in that paragraph, so stop changing your meanings around to suit you. And I fail to see how a man cannot be "resonsible, selfless(though why does one need to be?), dependable, strong" if one is a sexual being and is aroused by sex.

I like how a few women in this thread have telling us men what it means to be a real man. To be honest, "a real man" isn't something that exists, and certainly isn't something that can be defined by something that a woman wants. I'm sure you'd jump down my throat pretty quick if I started telling you a "real woman" must always be receptive to sex, or cannot masturbate or something.

So, kindly shut up about a man/real man distinction, as every man is real.

nothing could be farther from the truth. if you're mincing words & talking semantics, then, yes, every man is real. they are all physically real.

i think you knew that i was talking figuratively. some men are dependable, some aren't. some men are considerate, some aren't. some are honest, some lie. some are caring, some are selfish. the list goes on.

if you truly care about your wife - or girlfriend, for that matter & depending on how serious you are - your pursuit of greatness will never stop. the day you stop trying to improve yourself is the day you to a disservice to your family.

Okay.... Err, basically, I'm not the man for you, neither would you be the woman for me. There are different types of people, with different lives and philosophies. You have such a bee in your bonet about porn, to the extent that it precludes and destroys all good qualities, but I see nothing to substantiate you. Obviously I know that your opinion of a "real man" is your figurative opinion, just one that I hope you know is subjective and not one that everyone else agrees with.

porn is entirely selfish. porn is thoughtless, self-centered, and dangerous. there is nothing admirable or edifying about porn. at its best, it's like a candy bar. at its worst, it's rat poison.

Porn is selfish, and self-concerning. There is nothing admirable about it, and women get intimidated when they aren't the only sexual release for their males, as it kills their feeling of self-worth. Get over it. I see porn as a chocolate bar, and maybe as dangerous as a chocolate bar, proportionately. Chocolate makes you fat, remember. I've said before that the reason porn is good is BECAUSE it's selfish. I spend a lot of my effort in ensuring that my partner has a great time, to that end I cannot concentrate on pleasuring myself to the max. I have a right to be selfish. Who else is looking after my needs/wants as rigerously as me? If I wasn't selfish I'd be dead.

can you show me, using either extreme, why any man wanting to be his best would indulge in either?

Maybe a man sees being his best as getting the most from life that he can. Maybe he has a more nihalistic point of view than you. Maybe he embraces his physicality and sensation rather than shunning it like some religious nut or wise man seeking not to cloud his head with physical pleasure.

Stop fighting about minor points like porn and use that energy to make your man not want to leave you.

ludicrous.

this sounds like it came from a 12 year old who's mad he didn't get to stay up late last night.

we don't use our energy to make our partner not want to leave us.

You don't use your energy to make your partner not want to leave you? Remove the double negative and you get "You use your energy to make your partner want to leave you", or at best "I make no effort for the sake of our relationship".

I see porn as a minor point. You don't, whatever.