[MiniVanMan]

Almost everything you said you wanted above, were things you wanted HER to do.
...I think most of us truly want these things in a relationship. And we should have them, so long as we're meeting their needs in return. So what do you want from YOU in this relationship?

I'm sorry, but I don't understand your question. Did you mean "what does she want from YOU in this relationship?"

Some time ago we took the love languages survey, and I came out bilingual. Half words of affection and half physical touch. Split exactly right down the middle. She came out overwhelmingly quality time, and she explained that to her that mostly means verbal communication. Well guess what? I SUCK at verbal communication. I'm very self-conscious of my inability to quickly express my thought. It takes so long for me to form a sentence that she is constantly finishing my sentences for me, and it pushes me away. Just LET ME FINISH MY FREAKING SENTENCE! It won't take long! JEEZ! Thank goodness our marriage counselor has called her on it a couple of times. It just doesn't seem to sink in, though.

So what she wants, mostly, is engaging conversation. Hers is rapid fire, machine gun speech. It's hard to get a word in edgewise. Meanwhile I'm trying to process all that she's said, and honestly, it overwhelms me. One time we went on a walk for an hour and literally, I'm not making this up, she talked nonstop the whole time, with nothing more than a "right" or "I see" or "yep" from me, because she wouldn't shut up! And it gave me a headache. That's not a figure of speech here. My head hurt. When we got home I had go into a quiet room and decompress.

So yeah, verbal communication is very difficult for me, and she doesn't make it any easier.

[jns]

It is not conversation unless at least two people are engaged and taking turns. Taking turns in conversation is a big problem in modern society where many people think they are God's gift to the world and others should be in awe of what they are saying. Their speeches are like filibusters. She needs to give you gaps, you have to put sound bites in those gaps.

Also, instead of "right" "I see" or "yep", try "I love you", "I want to hug you", "I want to kiss you" or "I want to lick you all over". Of course, you should mean it if you use any particular one, but say something that plays to your affectionate words typing.

[StillLearnin]

My wife and I read the book Hot Monogamy and did the exercises (she abandoned it about half way through though, which irritates me because she knew how important completing the exercises were to me, but that's a different thread). You two did the Love Languages, which is a good start too. Hot Monogamy addresses problems like you described where your wife won't let you get a word in. It's all about understanding each other, and how each are wired. The problem is that both parties have to want to work it out, otherwise you'll be talking (or trying to talk about it) until the cows come home. You need to understand the deeper intimate connection she needs, and she needs to understand the physical touch and love that you need. Both have to be willing to meet in the middle. If she knows that machine gun fire conversation literally gives you a headache, and cares, she would understand to not communicate so much at a time. If you know that she needs to feel more emotionally connected to you to have sex, then you would do whatever it takes to help her feel that way.

But, I've gone through similar situation as you are experiencing, and know that you can only do so much (my wife's love language is actions, where she likes love to be expressed to her by doing things to help her and the family, which I have always done, but it wasn't getting me anywhere because she didn't understand [well, actually ignored, is the right word] my love language needs, which is similar to yours with the physical touch and words of appreciation). Eventually you get to where you say enough is enough and you can't do anymore. I don't think you are there yet though because you are just starting this process, and she has expressed to you that she doesn't feel emotionally connected. (My wife would say that she has been 100% happy and satisfied with the love and care I was showing her over the past 25 years) When you get to the point where she can express that she is emotionally satisfied, and things don't change, then it's "enough is enough" time for you.

But you're going to have to give it time to resolve the deeper issues. Be patient. If the marriage is worth saving it's worth the patience.

[sourpuss]

Go get the book '5 simple steps to take your marriage from good to great'
It goes over all the communication problems that you and your wife are having. It's really informative in explaining how men and women think, feel and react differently. Seriously, go get it today. I think you'd really benefit from it.

[Ashlee T.]

Did you mean "what does she want from YOU in this relationship?"

Nope...I mean what do you expect from yourself? There have to be things you can improve upon in the relationship. There have to be things you could work on that might help to bond an emotional connection and reignite the spark. Try not to focus on specifics you want from HER....focus on the big picture for you both.

[MiniVanMan]

Y'know, the more I think about this whole masturbation thing, the more I realize that it was the secrecy that upsets me as much as anything. It was a part of her life for so long that I didn't know about. We don't keep secrets from each other. We've never lied to one another. But this just feels dishonest to me.

What else do I not know about her and what she does when we're not together?

Am I being irrational?

[CHANDLERS WISH]

The best bet there is to ask yourself "why" she didn't tell you and truthfully, open your thought pattern in that regard.

It may not be secrecy persay, rather, embarrased? Or pot calling the kettle black? So how do I explain it, when I only do it a couple of times, but he likes to masterbate all the time?

CW

[A Dying Breed]

So far from what I'm reading, and not trying to pick on you. Also remember I'm a guy. But it seems alot of these problems are stemming from sex.

You keep saying you have all these problems. ex.) "yeah I know I'm doing that, it's a problem and I'm doing it".

You're admitting all these faults and problems of how you're thinking about the relationship, but you aren't even trying to fix them. You're just announcing them, but don't really care whether or not YOU fix your own problems.

By no means is your wife perfect or completely in the right by this. But from everything you've said, 95% of what you want is things she needs to work on. Relationships are supposed to be 50/50, and you're acting like you're already at your 50 percent mark and she needs to do it too. You're not even close. As long as you aren't trying to let go or fix some of the problems you have, why should she?

Also, you said sex is the strongest way for you to connect with her. But she doesn't feel that way at all. And you aren't even making an effort or trying to find all these other ways of intimacy. For woman, sex is a RESULT of an emotional connection, not vice versa.

You're upset because you want her to want to have sex with you, even though she's hurt and feeling a gap between your emotional connections. So far you've been blaming all these different things on her.

And by no means is she perfect, and she definitely is not fulfilling her 50% yet. She is constituting 50% of this problem. But with that said, SO ARE YOU. If you are really trying your best to fulfill your half and fulfill her needs again, I can almost guarantee she will try to fill up her half. But you want her to do all the work.

You want her to be the bigger person and start fixing her 50% of the relationship. You want to be the victim and for her to make it up to you. But you both have EXACTLY the same amount of blame. Yet you are not willing to blame yourself. And when you are, you make excuses of how she did something first and your detachment was a response.


I know I sound like an a-hole. But GET OVER YOURSELF. You have the EXACT same amount of blame in this. Be the bigger person and the man in the relationship and do your part.

If you fulfill your 50% of the relationship, and she continues to not change anything, then you are the victim. Right now you are just part of the problem and you're purposely making the problem worse to spite her and to make her apologize first.

Why does she need to apologize first? Why cant you be the bigger person, the leader in the relationship, and do your best to fix it?

It sounds like you're making excuses to leave. You aren't really trying to fix this relationship. You just want her to be wrong so you can leave and feel like you had no part in this.


I am sorry, from one man to another. I really am sorry. But you need to MAN UP and accept your half of the responsibility. And you need to fix it. Or else you aren't gonna be happy, even if you marry someone else.

Relationships take work and effort from both parties. Even if ONE person of the two causes a problem, they both have to fix it.

[jns]

ADB: it seems that your message changed between post #4 and post #78. What brought you to shift your position? I'm not attacking either position.

[emptypea2001]

So as a man, married for 30 years, here's my take. For women, sex with their mate is an emotional event. For me, it was always about the orgasm, the ejaculation relief. If there was a connection as a result - fine, but not necessary. In that sense, having sex was great masturbation because of all the stimulation leading up to the climax made the climax more and more intense.

For my wife, though, the climax, while important, is dependant on the overall connection she is feeling for hours leading up to having sex and throughout the sexual encounter. The technical apects of her orgasm are secondary.

While most posts here don't agree, I do understand what your wife means when she talks about her masturbation - 'it's just something she does to get off and then forgets about it'. There is a definite double standard here with her upset about your obsession with having sex and planning your masturbation but this is very common. I had been married about four years before I discovered that my wife masturbated (and believe me it was a lot more than twice a week - probably is for your wife as well). It secretly turned me on that she did this and didn't tell me, so I didn't tell her I knew for quite a few years; actually after she walked in on me masturbating and getting very upset with me. After a lot - a lot of talking, I finally got her to understand that I have a biological imperative to ejaculate 3-4 times per week and had even been told I should by my urologist (white lie). I convinced her that it was not a substitute for being with her, but with schedules and different sex drives; I was satisfied if we could have sex with each other once or twice per week and would not push to have sex just so I could get off.

I also, finally, got her to admit that she masturbates also - I just kept it totally normal with no jealousy; that I understood that it is something separate from how each of feels about being together.

My advice? Stop pushing the sex; don't even bring it up. Don't tell her you masturbate, don't try to make her feel guilty if she does. Just be there for her, make her feel good about herself, but be a little aloof and she will come to you with more sex than you can dream of.