[CHANDLERS WISH]

You don't want the dishes or towels or anything really....

When I left, i took a GE "free interest for 12 month" loan and bought the lot... No way do you want to sleep in the same bed, use the same fridge, or sit on the same couch.... Let her have it all, and put a dollar figure on it with your Divorce.

Can your family go and get your "personal things" pictures, things that are important to you? That may be a better way to go?

The 4 years of "ignoring her", well it does play a part, it can make a person fall out of love if they constantly feel second best... Remember, my ex-husband rode his motor bike every chance, leaving me at home, after working long hours, doing nothing but housework, or cooking instead of getting out there are a couple and enjoying life together... It wore me down..

But, that doesn't excuse her for moving on before breaking off a marriage.. I didn't, you have to have respect there. My ex and I don't talk, but we do send funny emails that have been sent to us, onto each other 17 months later...

It is what it is...Can't change falling out of love, he still wishes I was back, but he would not change a thing, he would still be a batchelor and live his life, without me that is something you chose not to do, you saw that there was a reason to stop the games and you did, 8 months before you left.

That should have meant the world to a woman, and enough time to re-gain the marriage and relationship if there was love in it to start with...

So, don't let her use that as the "blame" tool / card. Because all that I said above is true... I certainly would have given the marriage another go if he had stopped, and also got councelling for "emotional abuse" but that's another story.

See, if your family can get your personal stuff out of the house so at least you know that things you cherish are safe.

AND, I love WC's thoughts on recording words for your son...

It's going to be a long road, but one that you will jump the hurdles as you travel along it, and come to a new corner at the end of it, with no hurdles left only a gleaming fun road to next travel down.

CW

[Little]

Well, I asked my lawyer what he thinks I should do. He says to roll with this, but we will hold her back from moving out of the house. He said its in my best interest to just get this done and it would save me thousands of dollars in the process. I paid 3grand today for his official services ><

She is being very stup1d. She had the nerve to email me today and say this:

"You know exactly why I am leaving you Tyler, it is not that you cheated, it is that you were addicted to a video game for 4 YEARS and neglected me as your wife/friend and you continued to do so once our son was born. YOU HAVE NO ONE BUT YOURSELF TO BALME FOR THIS! So you will hear from my lawyer when I get the list of items together. I am taking what is rightfully mine, and I will split all the other stuff down the middle, like the dishes, towels etc."

While it is partly true, with the video game thing. Its just odd that she knows I gave it up over 8 months ago and yet NOW she is doing the divorce, not back then. So, who knows.
She is being vindictive and spiteful.

I knew that was an issue, but That dose not justify her actions on any level. I will not let her get to me.

There are three versions to every story: "my" side, "your" side, and the truth.
What I'm going to say is not what you want to hear, I'm sure, so I'm going to preface it by saying that she has "broken the rules" by doing all this damage to you while you're deployed.
However, as a former soldier, I'm certain that she already knows "the rules." So why would she break them so deliberately?
Because she's hurt? Because she has her own issues? Because she's been neglected by you? From what you said in your first post, maybe she didn't want to have a baby?
Moreover, there is an actual mental disease called Postpartum Depression that she may be suffering from.
Things don't seem salvageable, from what you're saying. She's gone too far. But you hating her and talking down about her is not going to keep you safe. She stuck around for four years while you were addicted to a video game, and according to her, neglecting her. I assume you were being deployed regularly at the same time? In the course of 4 years, eight months isn't so very long. This woman obviously loved you at some point to have stayed with you so long, and has reason to resent you.
There are a million things that could be wrong other than her just being some terrible woman who hates you.
Only you can decide what you really need to do, but putting all the blame on her and calling her vindictive and spiteful is not going to cut it. No court in the country will take her son away from her just because she's dating someone else, and you know as well as I do that you can't be guaranteed not to deploy. You will be dealing with this woman for the rest of your life, and you will have to learn to respect her as your son's mother.
I hope you find peace with this so that no harm comes to you during your deployment.

[Guest]

Ok girls wait a minute. Now I don't want to get into some big debate here in front of thack. But please, this is just what LLL bro't a thread on back in Sept. remember - I read it all to day, my, loaded with goodies.

As soon as you find out that thack had a gaming issue, oh now it's a different story. Ok, I'm not going to deny that, but and that is a Big, but.

Him having gaming issues and her doing this to him while he's deployed to me is totally irevelant to his real issue at hand, read it, reat it again and again!!!!
The man is over seas serving his country for you and me and her, and all of us and she does this to him while he's gone. Woa Nelly!

This is still an ultimate blow below the belt.

To me this is an issue like if she burnt the bacon for 4 yrs. and thack never met the issue head on but then in her most vulnerable time in life, thus far and says see ya you burn the bacon to much! No, No, a thousands times no!

OK thack you know where the problems are more than all of us. You maybe even holding something back from us, we are trusting, after all you did put the letter out there for all for us to see. I know you did not have to do that. Just like I didn't have to confess to some of the things I've been going thru.

You keep doing what you've been doing, take it easy, so don't sweat it, this thing is going to work out - I don't know where you're deployed other that Iraq - but be safe, don't get careless. We don't want you coming back in a body bag, ok!
Little
I know you mentioned she has broken all the rules but i just got a "little" stirred i guess, pardon me.
Quote by "Little"
You will be dealing with this woman for the rest of your life, and you will have to learn to respect her as your son's mother.

You will have to come to terms with this thack it's a fact so the sooner you get it out of your system the better, so you handle things well with your son and he grows up mentally stable.

My ex talked about me bad in front of my son all the time while he was growing up. I on the other hand never said a bad word about her in front of him. When he grew up to be a man we had a discussion about it and he told me ( I was grateful ) he knew later in his life she was wrong and it was just bitterness coming out, that seed of poison. But, some children can't cope well and grow up bitter themselves. So, be careful!

Keep us posted Brother!

[Little]

He said from the beginning that he had the gaming issues. We have to see both sides of the issue. I'm the last person to be man-bashing or misunderstanding of the issues soldiers face overseas.
But it's also extremely difficult to be the person at home. It's bad enough that your man is gone on deployments risking his life all the time, but getting neglected while he's home too? Everybody has a limit, and nobody likes to be pushed to it. I'm behind Thack all the way in that she has GONE TOO FAR, and I'm the one who said she's broken all the rules. If this is a case of me "sticking up for my girls," may lightening strike me now.

[Guest]

Little
I know you mentioned she has broken all the rules but i just got a "little" stirred i guess, pardon me.

I readily admitted you said that, and I said Pardon me, I apologize.
I guess even tho I seen the letter just like everyone else did, I wasn't going to bring it up because he confessed openly to us all.
I felt it was enough. It is a very touchy subject for me and I got a little warm, when I seen a little sympathy. For some reason I don't feel any. That is why I mentioned the Bacon deal. Yes I know, it's not the best comparison but it's not far from it.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

In-need.

Must be close issue to your heart.

Pretty sure as well that I said, there is no excuse, regardless you leave end of story, then see someone new... "Like me".... WALK.

AND:- Not to let her blame him for that.. the 4 years... it's not an excuse.

Fact is everyone has issues in relationships full stop... People fall out of love full stop.. Doesn't matter why, it happens, full stop..

Don't cheat on your partner, WALK, and then get on with your life - FACT.

My fact...

CW

[thack]

A little more perspective.. side 100284840.6 :P

Ok, a little more on the gaming thing, what is funny (kinda) is the game has not been out for 4 years, NEXT month it will hit its 4 year mark, I stopped playing it back in April, and before that I had cut it down to ONLY playing it while her and our son were asleep. IF they were not sleeping the game was not on.

The game came out while she was deployed (so yes, I understand what its like to be the one at home too, I did not like it at all) I bought it (as I have always been a guy who enjoys a good video game- never been an issue before. Ever) and started playing it to help me pass the time while she was deployed AND to keep me out of the bars and away from temptation of doing things that I would not like to do.

When she got home from her deployment, she was so bottled up an distant it was unreal, we talked about it a lot, we had kept in good communication while she was gone, I did most of the work on that, sending letters, emails, cards, boxes, and even driving to her office at the Air Force base to use her phone so I could call her without the 15minute time limit. I did more for her during her cushy deployment than she has ever done for me on my hardship tours. But I did not hold that against her, I just wanted to show her that I cared about her while she was gone and that I missed her. But like I said, once she got home she was completely and totally distant, abrasive, not sexual at all, not open at all (more than normal) and it was very difficult, I felt alone in my own home. I did not want to go away from her and leave the house, SO, I went to my game, I was always right there, and I would tell her that, she would be on the couch and be ignoring me, so, I just simply said "well I am going to go log on and bs with the guys a little, let me know if you need anything or if you want to do anything, I am just in the other room" I would give her a hug and a kiss and tell her I loved her and go to my computer. And about every 30min or so, as the game allowed, I would run into the living room and "hug-rape" ((:P)) give her a hug and a kiss and tell her I loved her. It always got me very odd looks.

When she would finally open up to me about the game, I would stop playing it almost completely, I still enjoyed it, it was a massive social gathering with video game stuff, it was nice, a way to stay in touch with old friends and even family but not just be messenger'ing... But I would do stuff for her, with her, treat her as well as I could, and she would never open up any more, she would just close back down, this happened for 3 years. IT was an endless cycle, and yeah, I probably could have cut the game out all together and just forced myself into her but I found that I did not have the strength to do that. I felt alone for 3 years in my own home, and maybe she did to, but I made the effort to reach out to her, she may have in her own way and I did not see it, I don't know, we became roommates for a while, not so much married and loving, but we were able to sit and talk for a long time before we decided to have a baby, and we agreed that we still loved each other and that I would cut back on the game quite a bit, which I did, it was not as much of my day, but she was also still very very distant. She has not opened up to me or shown me true passion for anything other than her job in the past 5 years or more, I have been confused and overworking to try and win her love for longer than she feels that I was "neglecting" her by playing the game. Yes, I know that me giving a lot of attention to that game probably invalidated her, and made her feel like 2nd place, but the fact is, IF I would have seen the woman, that pretty little woman I married 7 years ago, if she would have come out of her shell, I would have thrown my entire computer away, but instead all I had was a very distant and now, spiteful woman. SO yeah, I know the game was an issue, but I put out effort through that game quite a bit. Always made her feel special on the days she was supposed to feel special, always took an interest in her work and her day, always tried to go do things with her that she would enjoy, I did everything that I can think of BESIDES get rid of the game much earlier than april of this year. And yes, that does tug at my brain and I had some guilt issues with that for a while, but I was just as lonely as she was, and at least I can say that I tried my hardest to salvage the hunk of steam that we realized we had in may. FOR my son I tried as hard as I could to reconcile, but the reasons she keeps rotating as to why she is leaving me and has been having an affair keep changing. SHE only put the gaming part into the letter (thats link number 8 in a long chain of emails yesterday) when I listed all the things that she had done to make me suspicious of her cheating over the past 5 years. And then reminded her that she had been diagnosed with HPV in 2001, which she chooses to forget.

Right now she is starting to lash out at our babysitters because they let me call and talk to my son, she is intentionally taking our son out of their great care and moving to the other side of the city which is destroying one of them, she has been crying and emailing me all week about it. She feels badly for our son, new house, new daycare, loss of good friends of his all at once is a huge change for him and she is not thinking of his welfare. She is moving to probably within a mile or so of her boyfriends house. It is things like that, that make me say she is spiteful and vindictive, there is absolutely no reason i cannot call and talk to my son and actually get an update on his life from the babysitters because she will not give it to me.

She gets woken up by my phone call at 11am Sunday morning, she is passed out on the couch while he is awake in the swing or his exersaucer, she rolls over puts the phone up to his ear and just leaves it there until he gets frustrated with it, then says to me "well he put his pacifier in" and that's it, I say thank you and hang up. So of course calling the babysitters is so much better, I get to talk to them about him for 30minutes or more at times and speak to him 2 - 3 times during the phone call, its awesome, it is what she should be doing, but because she is just projecting her issues onto me so badly, its effecting my relationship with my son.

And in-need, I totally and completely agree with you on the whole, i will not bad mouth my X in front of my son, my mother did that for years as well and I know how that feels. I will not even have a woman over the house while I have him for a LONGLONG time, let alone even speak of his mother in any way other than "mommy". He is a child and not a cause of this at all, we are grown adults, we made our choices we discussed what we knew it meant to get pregnant, and buy a house, and she is going back on her word to me that we would work harder to make sure we provided our son/ daughter (we didnt know at the time) with the life that we never got to have as children.

SO yes, I have a lot of frustration and anger right now, I am praying for her instead of cursing her, I vent her because its not directed TOO her, its not anyone she will ever meet (hopefully, lol) and its healthier to get it out than it is to keep it in, I can see what happens when you fight feelings instead of allow them to wash over you! I am trying my best not to hate her right now, I really am, but with each new week its a new event on a reason why I should. Real people dont do this sort of thing, genuine people do not act like this, honest people dont kick someone while they are down repeatedly. IF she wanted a divorce then in may when she mentioned it, she should have stuck with it and we could have worked through it easily, but she said we can fix it, lets work together, and then once her mother came to town in August, that suddenly changed into "YOU ARE WORTHLES ... BLAH BLAH BLAH ECT.." and then to this. Make a choice and stick to it in my opinion, dont let others sway your LIFE like that. We never even got out of the gate on our attempt to fix our issues. She just is not strong, I offered to get out of the army for her, and I have had a very successful career, I have made E7 in 7 years, and I am up for E8 in 2 more, I dont know many people who have done that. But i would gladly give it up for my family, but that was not even an option.

Yes there are 2 sides to each story and maybe a 3rd, but my side is the one with out the infidelity or "boyfriend/girlfriend" and backstabbing.

-end rant and rave- I do appreciate all the feed back and you all have been a large help in me being able to progress like I have in the past couple months, from suicidal and depressed to focused and driven with some anger mixed in. one extreme to the other, but I plan to come home with an open heart and an open mind and as little hate or anger as possible, 3 more months to work that out.

[CHANDLERS WISH]

Thack, you may have been "living" with someone, and it's obvious that you were an "aware" husband, one whom was not totally selfish, acknowledged the effort required for marriage, but you make it sound like in reality for the past 3 years at least, you have just been "living" in a house with a "woman"... Yes?

No, matter what you tried, did, you couldn't bring it around again and when you left, she chose to make that the break..

In-other-words, it does sound to me that this marriage was gone a long time ago.

Perhaps you are open, she closed.
Perhaps you are deep, she is not.
Perhaps you are emotional, she is cold.
Perhaps you two were teenagers who fell in love, and you moved in together, into a marriage pretty well still as young people, where you can and did and wanted marriage and all that it takes, she grew and didn't.

It may very well not be you, not be her, just life, the intial love you both had for each other was not long-lasting "forever" as expected.

If you see that, then maybe you should be saying to her, there is no blame, obviously we were young you fell out of love with me, so let's just love our son and get on with our individual lives.

I know your going through so many emotions, but if she is being ultra stubborn, if you can not use the information of her finding a man whilst still be married, if that will do nothing at all to the Divorce, or Custody, then you may have to use physcology on her now that you have vented to her, and act as if you don't love her anymore either and that it doesn't matter one bit.

Maybe, that will allow her to let you into your son's life more, which at this point I am gathering is the "major" thing that you really want as the outcome of all of this.

In other words, now look at what you want out of this and focus only on that for the time being, and use your strength that you have to focus only on that,even if you have to "white lie" in order to make her feel you don't care at all, in order to get what you want as the end result.

Just my thoughts.


CW

[thack]

&lt;Shrug&gt;

CW, It very well could have been, she tried to leave when we lived in North Carolina but she was under the guise that she did not want her Chemo Therapy to hold back my career, I had all ready pushed my report date to my new unit back by 6 months and she said she felt guilty of that, so she moved out. Whether or not that was true, I do not know and probably never will.

I can't really say exactly how I felt, I was in the house with a woman yes, and I tried very hard, at times, and at other times I did not have the energy or the drive, so this is not all on her shoulders, but its not all on mine either. That is something I understand and grasp, I am not here to just bash her for the past few years of our marriage.

The past few years have been very confusing, the baby thing- she was extremely scared to get pregnant again after the Molnar pregnancy in may of 05. I will never forget may 5'th 2005. NEVER. So that is why when she brought up the baby thing (she brought it up) we talked on it for a very long time, I told her I did not want her to feel any pressure at all and that if she was not ready that we could just wait, there was no rush. NO rush at all, I understood completely, I was scared to, to not only lose my wife (because last time she tried to leave so I had that fear, as well as what if the cancer DID come back, I would lose her AND another child- I was very scared of that)

So we talked a whole lot about the baby thing, trying to make sure our heads where were they were and that we were secure in our marriage, and happy. IF she lied during all that, there is absolutely nothing I can do, if she was indeed unhappy and lied to move forward and have a baby then that was the wrong thing in my opinion and I am sure you would agree with that. Everyone knows that having a child does not improve a weak relationship, it actually adds more stress and problems and changes the workload from re-connecting to just figuring out what in the to do.

Yes I know the video game was bad, I feel that, I felt that, I know that. . . but I did not want temptation on cheating on her by going to the bars all the time, but at the same time I was always hoping she would come into the computer room and say "lets go do this" and I would pull the plug happily and move on out with her. We were at odds with each other on that, both in different rooms praying for the same thing to happen and its sad, she wont acknowledged that now, she just claims that I did this and I did that, and you treated me like this, and that, and ect...

So, as far as me just living with a "woman" in the house, eh, I wouldn't go as far to say that I dont think, I watched my dad live with a "woman" for years and he did what he needed to do in his mind and he was there when she pulled out of her depression, that is what I was expecting with this, I expected her to some day everything kind of lift off of her shoulders and she would approach me and we could move forward together, instead she just held up resentment and anger inside of her and pushed herself further from me. I was not angry with her, not during those times, very frustrated at times yes but never angry or bitter towards her.

I would get discouraged at her withdrawals from me when I would reach out to her, and the same thing would happen with her towards me, it was like ping pong. best way to describe it. Just one day she's reaching out to me and I was withdrawing from a recent rejection and then same thing when I would reach out to her, it was heart breaking at times.

I still knew that the woman in my house was my wife, and I had a lot of love for her, and it continued to grow, and I wish I was not in this situation today, I would gladly go from today to what it was a year ago when our son was born, (knowing what I know today) and basically throw away my computer and just make the right decision to not have my "escape" or "coping mechanism" and just blatantly focus on US as a couple, start the marriage counseling before all of this, and I believe that I would have been successful. I think that .. I don't know its that whole hind sight is 20/20 thing, "If I only knew then what I know now" situation..

Honestly, I know it was both of us that led us into this whole patch of life we are in right now, but I believe that she went a little further outside the realm of "honorable" or even "decent" on many levels. Its very sad, I am just trying to remain civil in this proceeding, I have given her every luxury in this divorce, taking on the house in a crappy market, continuing to give her money when I am not required to since she is living in my house, giving her all the brand new furniture that we purchased during our marriage. I have not withheld anything from her because I am a good man inside.

Underneath all of this , confusion, anger, frustration, disappointment, and sadness/emotion, I am still a good, honorable, and loyal man. And I am sleeping better and better every night because that is coming out. No matter what she is saying to me or trying to do to me, it wont change who I am, because I know I never went out and cheated on her, or acted like she is right now, I never went out of my way to purposefully hurt her like she has to me.

Yes this may seem a little childish- but her myspace / facebook accounts, she knew I was looking at them and made very rash comments and remarks on her pages about how worthless of a father and husband that I was, as well as she tried to post the stuff on my personal pages as well (I just blocked her after the first attempt) that is where I get off calling her vindictive and spiteful. She has gone out of her way to do those things as well as make sure she has gotten caught out on the town with random men in places she knows OUR friends hang out, and she knew that whole "oh don't tell him what I'm out doing, its our little secret ok... wink" was all Bull-shi7, that's a woman who is trying to make someone who is all ready emotionally destroyed even worse. Talk about disrespectful and inhuman to the T.

I do not want to hate her, that is why I continue to talk to my counselor, chaplain, friends, and you people "and yes I mean it when I say you people"

[NLB]

Hi Thack,

The crying at 2 a.m. feedings and at bedtime sound similar to what I went through when I had a mild case of postpartum depression after having my daughter 1.5 years ago. It turned out to be caused by a severe progesterone deficiency. I started taking natural progesterone until my levels normalized and it really helped. Your wife is recovering from quite a few traumatic events, all of which by themselves could cause her to be depressed. However, it might be worth checking with an obgyn, general practicioner, or councelor about postpartum depression.

Thack,

I apologize if my last posting seemed a bit out of context. I'm tired this evening and somehow accidentally missed the last 2 pages of posts, so it was in response to one of your very early posts. I wish you the best.

NLB